The big "What if"

[magneto]

I can't help but think how without Souness, Newcastle and Blackburn have done amazingly well this season. This takes me back to how he systematically fecked things up for us.

 

I was wondering though, who else was on that list for possible Dalglish replacements? I recall Hansen saying he turned the job down. I also think Ronnie Moran was a possible contender although I think he didn't want the job on a permanent basis.

 

Who else was in line and who did you guys want back then (I was only 10 so can't remember much from that era)?

[DaveLFC]

I can't help but think how without Souness, Newcastle and Blackburn have done amazingly well this season. This takes me back to how he systematically fecked things up for us.

 

I was wondering though, who else was on that list for possible Dalglish replacements? I recall Hansen saying he turned the job down. I also think Ronnie Moran was a possible contender although I think he didn't want the job on a permanent basis.

 

Who else was in line and who did you guys want back then (I was only 10 so can't remember much from that era)?

 

Hindisight is a wonderful thing and who knows what would have happened had we not had Souness at the helm. I do not really remember who was in the running but after Dalglish I guess it seemed logical to appoint another player to the job. If only we had gone for experience instead then maybe things would have been different.

 

Souness from what I remember went out and bought a lot of foreign players that did not really set the world alight. Wasn't Glenn Hysén one of his signings? Also Torben Piechnik? I know all managers buy poor players and I'm probably being really unfair to Souness but the fact is he was our manager and the club did decline, wether it would have under any other manager is something we will never know.

[HeWonItFromBrock]

Incredible - I was going to start a thread on exactly this topic this morning!!!

 

From what I remember the list had people like John Toshack, Ronnie Moran, Roy Evans, Ron Yeats, Phil Neal on it - very few outsiders.

 

Roy Evans would have been a steadier pair of hands, however for an outsider appointment there were very few good managers aroumd at the time. In hindsight Bobby Robson would have been a great choice.

Edited May 3, 2006 by HeWonItFromBrock

[Joxer]

Wasn't Toshack the main contender and the one we wanted originally?, til he turned it down.

[Armin_Tamzarian]

At the time it was seen as a great appointment. I was delighted as it seemed as if we'd once again managed to appoint from within, depite the years since he left Souness was still one of our own and he'd been succesful in Scotland. Plus he'd played in Italy and was trying to bring Continental ideas into management. In some ways he was ahead of his time.

 

Of course in hindsight either Evans should've been backed there and then as the evolution candidate or someone with completely new thinking should've been brought in. You have to understand the boards position though, we'd been the most successful club in football history and where else did you look but from within your own?

[Owen1978]

What was keegan doing during that period? wasnt he never considered?

[koppper]

Souness went and sold many of our best players because he thought they were too old - they weren't. They they proceeded to batter us whenever we met them. He decided on a revolution when it wasn't needed.

 

I think Steve Nicol was a prime example of this, he played at the top level for ages after getting pushed out. I think that this was the main reason we dipped out of the top two, something which we are only now recovering from.

[Guest JimmyJames]

What was keegan doing during that period? wasnt he never considered?

 

[Armin_Tamzarian]

I think Keegan had Spanish business interests at the time and was out of football.

[Beardsley]

I think Souness has gotten far too much of the blame for our downfall.

 

As someone mentioned, he did change things around and were probably ahead of his time at that moment.

In hindsight, he could have eased new faces in at a lesser rate without getting rid of so many of the older players (ahhhh, hindsight is a beautiful thing, isn't it?). But a change looked imminent at that time.

 

If I remember correctly, R. Moran was the first choice, but he turned the opportunity down. Don't think he wanted the preassure.

[Dule]

maybe things would have been better if Kenny had of stayed on? But then again i seem to remember a whole heap of people saying that the Decline had started under Kenny, because of no new young blood being brought in by him?

[cymrococh]

I wanted Toshack, but was very happy when we got Souness.

[Guest Wilder]

Souness went and sold many of our best players because he thought they were too old - they weren't. They they proceeded to batter us whenever we met them. He decided on a revolution when it wasn't needed.

 

I think Steve Nicol was a prime example of this, he played at the top level for ages after getting pushed out. I think that this was the main reason we dipped out of the top two, something which we are only now recovering from.

 

Hate to be pedantic - but Nicol was the one who didn't go. Stayed until '95, and was even captain under Souness for a time.

 

Now if you're talking about Houghton, Staunton (even Souness owned up to that one), Beardsley.... I'm right with you.

 

Still - at least there was that mental 3-3 game against Man Utd, with Clough scoring 2 and Bjornebye setting up Ruddock for the equaliser... strange days...

[Guest Bernie]

Hate to be pedantic - but Nicol was the one who didn't go. Stayed until '95, and was even captain under Souness for a time.

 

Now if you're talking about Houghton, Staunton (even Souness owned up to that one), Beardsley.... I'm right with you.

 

Still - at least there was that mental 3-3 game against Man Utd, with Clough scoring 2 and Bjornebye setting up Ruddock for the equaliser... strange days...

 

Never been a huge fan of Souness the manager but the story that he solely destroyed the club in his years in charge is just too convenient. He perhaps did try to change things too quickly, but Dalglish also failed to bring in enough good talent in his final seasons to replace an aging team. Souness did also bring Rob jones to the club, but just wasn't as inspired with some of his other signings. Bjornebye wasn't terrible, but some of the others, Carter, SPeedie Piechnik etc.... what was he thinking?

[smithdown]

Never been a huge fan of Souness the manager but the story that he solely destroyed the club in his years in charge is just too convenient. He perhaps did try to change things too quickly, but Dalglish also failed to bring in enough good talent in his final seasons to replace an aging team. Souness did also bring Rob jones to the club, but just wasn't as inspired with some of his other signings. Bjornebye wasn't terrible, but some of the others, Carter, SPeedie Piechnik etc.... what was he thinking?

 

 

Weren't Carter and Speedie signed by Kenny?

[Benitez]

I think Souness has gotten far too much of the blame for our downfall.

 

As someone mentioned, he did change things around and were probably ahead of his time at that moment.

In hindsight, he could have eased new faces in at a lesser rate without getting rid of so many of the older players (ahhhh, hindsight is a beautiful thing, isn't it?). But a change looked imminent at that time.

 

 

 

yep, and what is often ignored, is that Kenny had made some highly suspect signings late on in his time as manager, and the squad was already in decline.

 

Having said that, Souness then proceded to make a whole host of terrible transfers, both in and out of the club. Bad bad manager and tactician.

[DJM]

Weren't Carter and Speedie signed by Kenny?

 

Yup

[Earl Hafler]

yep, and what is often ignored, is that Kenny had made some highly suspect signings late on in his time as manager, and the squad was already in decline.

 

Having said that, Souness then proceded to make a whole host of terrible transfers, both in and out of the club. Bad bad manager and tactician.

 

Yep and not very good for player fitness either.

[charlie clown]

my biggest complaint with Souness was that he was a teriible judge of a player - he just used to buy anybopdy because he could. In a way it's a bit like Mourinho now, buying all the 'top' players because he's got the money to do it, purely (it seemed to me at the time) to stop other clubs getting them. Why any other club would want Paukl Stweart is a mystery that remains unsolved.

 

It was like he was one of those people who come on here year in year out demanding that we sign the likes of Michael Ricketts.... you know, up from a lower division, one half-decent season in the premiership and then sink without trace. But in that one season, half the world think he's the best thing since Ian Rush. Souness seems a bity like that to me - someone says a player is good and he'll sign em whether they are or not. Sadly, he had the biggest budget of his career (relatively) speaking to do that with when he was with us.

[Boca]

Wasn't this the era of the foreigner rule in Europe, where teams could only field three non English players. I think this contributed to Souness deciding to sell a lot of decent players such as Staunton and Houghton.

It still doesn't excuse the mess he made of the overall job but he was put in an awkward position because of that rule.

[Guest mick the baker]

One of the funniest moments of the souness era ,was the time we played wimbledon away at selhurst park, i think it was 1993 and the great torben piechnik fell on his a*** resulting in their forward scoring a simple goal,then piechnik signalled to the bench pretending to have an injury,but really trying to cover up his feck up,we were sitting behind the dugout, and he got some unmerciful stick as he came off,yes souness bought some woeful players in his day but torben was right up there imo.

[Guest Cacodemon]

One of the funniest moments of the souness era ,was the time we played wimbledon away at selhurst park, i think it was 1993 and the great torben piechnik fell on his a*** resulting in their forward scoring a simple goal,then piechnik signalled to the bench pretending to have an injury,but really trying to cover up his feck up,we were sitting behind the dugout, and he got some unmerciful stick as he came off,yes souness bought some woeful players in his day but torben was right up there imo.

Souness was an obvious choice for manager, along with the other usual suspects, Toshack, Moran, etc. At the time, I would of doubted that the club would of even considered looking outside the sphere of Anfield. And on past history that was the correct and obvious thing to do.

 

However, the 'rot' had set in under Dalglish. As people have mentioned, some of the later purchases of King Kenny, were very short sighted and rather poor, the usual suspects of Speedie and Carter come to mind - although he did bring a young J Redknapp in also. The team of the late eighties were beginning to struggle, injuries were troubling some of the more established stars.

 

So when Souness came in, quiet rightly he knew changes had to be made. However from the off, some of his decisions were very poor. Selling a young Staunton was a poor move, and only for £1m (if memory serves!) However, in my opinion, ditching Beardsley as he was 'too old' must rank as his worst decision. Beardsley went on to be succesful with Everton and Newcastle, and his season or so with Andrew Cole was amazing.

 

Souness when blew a huge hole in the finances by purchasing the wrong players - but he did spend big. Roy Keane and Cantona to name two, were offered to Liverpool at one point or another, yet both were rejected! Players of very limited ability were brought in - Dicks and Walters, instantly spring to mind!

 

However, saying all this, with the whole 'cause and effect' rule. No Dalglish = no Souness = no Evans = no Houllier = No Benitez

 

...and at this moment in time, I'm sure we all are very, very pleased with Rafa....

[matty]

I said at the time, in one of my rarer moments of prescience that Souness would be a very bad decision, based purely on the donkeys he had signed at Rangers.

 

I could have managed them to win the Scottish league at that point, and any success he had there was absolutely no guide to his skills.

 

That said, the squad was in need of change at the time, but he made ALL the wrong decisions.

[Guest Marshy]

Anyone who watched Liverpool during the last couple of years of the kings reign could see that we weren't the Liverpool of old - the decline had already started, Alan Hansen said the last championship winning team (1990) was the poorest he'd been involved in and the average age of the squad was building higher than in previous years. Souness's crime was not handling the decline correctly and maybe someone more talented manager wise would have made sure the decline was less deeper and longer lasting. Only now do i think we've got someone (still early days but the signs are promising) who can be bracketed with the old guard of Shankly, Paisley and Fagan.

[anny road]

i dont know what some on here are smoking

 

Souness was to blame fot the decline of this club, it was down to him and him alone

 

Sure Dalglish bought some poor players (as do all managers) but SOuness took over a squad that was reigning champions, dismantled it and bought in a load of s***....Plus his training methods meant that players tended to pick up long term muscular injuries............

 

His signings in the main were a disgrace......with the exception of Wright, Jones and erm...erm..erm

 

Piechnik, Bjornebye, Dicks, Stewart etc etc etc

 

f***ing rubbish