The Crouch experiment

[Archangel]

I dont think now is the right time to question the ability of our strikers, the main trouble seems to be that there is a general lack of confidence running through the frontline and doubting the ability of the players is not going to help

 

I'd persist with Peter Crouch as a striker, he's not prolific and I don't think he'll ever be but he is able to win the ball and keep possesion, with good service he has that aerial threat and can generally throw a spanner in the works for any back four. These are definitely attributes to his game and give us the options Benitez frequently refers to

 

I believe that we need to be patient, its not working too well at the moment but there were few complaints until recently. Overall the team has improved since last year and we shouldn't expect miracles. Benitez values Crouch and I'm not going to disagree with that

 

same applies with Morientes

[Guest Kenny Park]

I dont think now is the right time to question the ability of our strikers, the main trouble seems to be that there is a general lack of confidence running through the frontline and doubting the ability of the players is not going to help

 

I'd persist with Peter Crouch as a striker, he's not prolific and I don't think he'll ever be but he is able to win the ball and keep possesion, with good service he has that aerial threat and can generally throw a spanner in the works for any back four. These are definitely attributes to his game and give us the options Benitez frequently refers to

 

I believe that we need to be patient, its not working too well at the moment but there were few complaints until recently. Overall the team has improved since last year and we shouldn't expect miracles. Benitez values Crouch and I'm not going to disagree with that

 

same applies with Morientes

Sounds like Neville Chamberlain 1938 "Peace in our time...." or "now is not the time to question our strikers"

We should not question them, we should bloody well fire them!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Nebraska Red]

I dont think now is the right time to question the ability of our strikers, the main trouble seems to be that there is a general lack of confidence running through the frontline and doubting the ability of the players is not going to help

 

I'd persist with Peter Crouch as a striker, he's not prolific and I don't think he'll ever be but he is able to win the ball and keep possesion, with good service he has that aerial threat and can generally throw a spanner in the works for any back four. These are definitely attributes to his game and give us the options Benitez frequently refers to

 

I believe that we need to be patient, its not working too well at the moment but there were few complaints until recently. Overall the team has improved since last year and we shouldn't expect miracles. Benitez values Crouch and I'm not going to disagree with that

 

same applies with Morientes

 

 

PATIENT!!!

 

we have had 15 games so far in 2006, and our forwards have scored 1 goal. if we had somebody in the reserves who looked likely to score, i would play him before Crouch or Morientes.

 

Crouch can only throw "spanners" if he is playing with someone who can feed off any of these "knockdowns." We don't have anybody like that so playing him is almost an exercise in futility. He is one part of a 2 headed attack force. In a way he is like Toshack, who was never the same player when Keegan did not play alongside him. They both fed off each other when they played together. A fit (and few years younger) Fowler would be the ideal foil for Crouch, but Fowler is not quite able to do that just yet.

[Owen1978]

I dont think now is the right time to question the ability of our strikers, the main trouble seems to be that there is a general lack of confidence running through the frontline and doubting the ability of the players is not going to help

 

I'd persist with Peter Crouch as a striker, he's not prolific and I don't think he'll ever be but he is able to win the ball and keep possesion, with good service he has that aerial threat and can generally throw a spanner in the works for any back four. These are definitely attributes to his game and give us the options Benitez frequently refers to

 

I believe that we need to be patient, its not working too well at the moment but there were few complaints until recently. Overall the team has improved since last year and we shouldn't expect miracles. Benitez values Crouch and I'm not going to disagree with that

 

same applies with Morientes

 

Head in sand!

 

There are strikers capable of doing what crouch does, but better - aerial ability > dont make me laugh, like someone said 3/4th choice striker at best. If someone gave me the choice of recouping the 7m we paid for him, id take there hand off!

 

What i would like to see is someone like gudjohnson in the crouch role, or even better Tevez, he's got strength, can hold up the ball, link up play, play with his back to goal, great touch for a small man, but he has pace, power, guile, creativity, agression like i said there are better options than crouch.

[realtarragona]

I think he's a good player. His best football for us I actually thought was during the time he wasn't scoring. His all round play was excellent and it was part of the reason why I wasn't too concerned with his goal drought.

 

He's been a bit hit and miss in the second part of the season though. And when his all round game drops, he really does need to start putting chances away to make up for it. It's excusable to a degree if everything else he does is fine but when it's not...

 

One problem I do have though, which is not really his fault, is that we seem to be playing it long far too often with him in the side. I know it's tempting when you have a 6'7 striker but even on Wednesday, when we were desperate for a goal, it seemed that the main idea was to just hit it long. I don't have a problem with mixing it up a bit but not to the extent where it's almost the main tactic.

[4411]

Whenever we play Crouch, Carra and Hyypiä just love hoofing the ball up to him and make him head it on to the striker that's, unfortunately, always behind him so its just a giveaway. Wish we could just play simple posession one touch attacking football like we did in the 70's, 80's and mid 90's (or until Houllier took over).

[sutty]

How likely do you think it is that Fowler will stay?

 

 

Very likely in my view

 

Cheap. Bothered. Scores

[McBain]

He's scored 4 league goals, and no matter how much he can hold the ball up, he's still scored 4 league goals

 

The argument that he's not in the side to score would only really be worth making if others around him are scoring goals. Which they aren't. I'm sure he'll still be here next season, but i'm not looking forward to it

[fred milne]

Crouch isn't the biggest problem, but play-it-safe Morientes might be

 

Niall Quinn

Friday March 10, 2006

The Guardian

 

Peter Crouch has had to cope with some pretty sustained abuse since Liverpool went out of the Champions League and I know how it feels. They used to call me "the beanpole who couldn't score" and sometimes I would lie awake at night wondering where the next goal would come from.

 

My guess is that Crouch has had a few of those sleepless nights this week but at least he was looking to make something happen against Benfica, which is more than can be said for the player alongside him. Everyone will remember the chances Crouch missed, yet Fernando Morientes never even had a look-in. Why? Because he wasn't gambling. He was playing it safe, controlling the ball, laying it off, waiting to see what might happen.

 

When he joined Liverpool it was with the reputation of an out-and-out goalscorer but in my opinion he's not a Premiership scorer. He doesn't gamble like a Robbie Fowler, a Michael Owen, an Andrew Cole or a Kevin Phillips. He wants everything precise and perfectly constructed for him to tap the ball into the net, and that doesn't work in England. And the worst thing? I'd guess that Morientes went home from Anfield on Wednesday and slept soundly.

 

It's time now that Rafael Benítez gave Fowler an extended chance. I've seen enough of Crouch and Morientes together to know that it's not going to work, because of Morientes. But I'm sure a prolonged period together of Crouch and Fowler will eventually come off. Djibril Cissé might be aggrieved with that assessment but I'm not sure his desire or ability is up to the right level.

 

For a player like Crouch to excel he needs someone alongside him who can penetrate. He won everything in the air on Wednesday but it didn't look dangerous because Morientes was playing it so safe. It would help Crouch to play beside someone who is prepared to gamble on where the ball might be. Morientes isn't that man, Fowler is.

 

People doubt Crouch and it's so easy to knock him down. I still believe in him but, a bit like me, he isn't a prolific scorer. He's honest and he's good at what he does but, that said, the next time he gets a headed chance he needs to be busting the back of the net rather than just directing it towards the corner.

 

When I look at him I see a lot of myself and what I sometimes went through. I went through a bad period in front of goal when I was a kid at Arsenal and I remember being so frustrated I did an interview with the Daily Mirror. You know the type of stuff: "It's not my fault, it's everyone else's fault etc etc." It was a human reaction but it was a childish reaction, and I wished I'd never done it when I saw the newspaper. I was really in the doldrums but, despite everything I'd said, I knew that if I was going to make my career work I would have to start scoring. You can either pretend it's not happening and that it's the fault of everyone else or you can meet the demons and see them off.

 

I would go down to my local pub and get some "friendly fire" or I would be lifted by a phone call from my family. You need to remain strong and it's admirable of Benítez to have tried to deflect the pressure from his strikers after Wednesday's game.

 

Deep down, though, Crouch and Morientes will know themselves. The statistics are always being rammed down their throats, for starters. That's one part of the modern game I'm glad I never had, because sleepless nights are bad enough as they are. Crouch probably didn't sleep a wink last night but when he gets out of bed and throws some water on his face it's another day. My advice? Forget the sniping and go for it.

 

http://football.guardian.co.uk/Columnists/...1727704,00.html

[Guest Murf]

Put him as center half, imagine him going up for the corners, great feet and controls the ball well, you heard it from me first, John Terry look out.

[Puskas]

Part of the problem is that Crouch is playing next to a misfiring striker (whoever that may be, take your pick).

 

We're playing much better possession football than we did last season, and for me a lot of that is down to Crouch being able to hold up the ball.

 

We just need a proper goalscorer (or a choice of two) to play next to him.

 

If Crouch was playing next to a regular goalscorer it would take the pressure of him to score and he'd probably relax a bit and score more. Just a pet theory of mine

[Guest Cardie]

Part of the problem is that Crouch is playing next to a misfiring striker (whoever that may be, take your pick).

 

We're playing much better possession football than we did last season, and for me a lot of that is down to Crouch being able to hold up the ball.

 

We just need a proper goalscorer (or a choice of two) to play next to him.

 

If Crouch was playing next to a regular goalscorer it would take the pressure of him to score and he'd probably relax a bit and score more. Just a pet theory of mine

 

Crouch is a mis-firing striker as well so not sure the others should take the blame with him excused.

 

Don't know why we're looking at others to 'take pressure off him' and score the goals for him, why can't he do that himself, at 7 million it's not unreasonable to expect him to do a complete job rather than half, other strikers aren't afforded the same luxury.

[David Hodgson]

I'm sad to say this but the Crouchie joke is up now.

 

He's awful in the air, slow, got poor movement, great feet for a giant....but rubbish feet for a normal sized man.

 

And he couldn't score in a brothel. I'd love to think we had so much money to spend that we could keep Crouchy at the club as a talismanic late Plan C substitute....but we haven't....and he has to go.

[crisps]

Not a success in my opinion and def not good enough for LFC

[Billy Dane]

There are other strikers in the queue for the exit before Crouch. We already need to buy two new strikers and can't see Rafa spending whatever budget he has on 3.

 

If he gets Kuyt and Owen, Crouch will probably be 3rd choice striker next season.

[Raj]

ffs give him a break.

 

he's been with us for 8 months. he's played well for the majority of the time, but he has not scored as many goals as he/we would have liked. its a big step up for him and i think he's shown that he can make the grade. benitez and the other players realise that he is pivotal to how we play at the moment.

 

i'm not excusing his lack of goals, but the burden of goals falls on the team as a whole too.

morientes, cisse, kewell, etc have not scored enough goals either. these are arguments that can be levelled at each of these players.

 

he knows he has to improve his goals tally, but lets see how he performs next season. i fully believe that he will not only improve his goals tally, but will improve his all round play too. i feel that he has been a positive signing, but there is more to come.

[RedLars]

niall quinn's article is excellent. i agree entirely with that.

 

think of this season as a whole, and crouch has contributed greatly to some brilliant football we have played. to write him off is foolish in my view. he wasn't signed to be a goalscorer, he's never going to be a twenty a season goalscorer. that man was supposed to be morientes and / or cissé.

 

crouch's positives outweigh his negatives. get the right type of partner alongside him and we'll see the benefit.

 

Agree that Crouchs all-around game is good and it appears he has given the rest of the team another outlet compared to last season. I never expected a twenty a season goalscorer but I'm a bit worries about his composure in front of goal. Granted Mori isn't helping much but even so I feel Crouch should have a higher goal tally than he does.

[David Hodgson]

niall quinn's article is excellent. i agree entirely with that.

 

think of this season as a whole, and crouch has contributed greatly to some brilliant football we have played. to write him off is foolish in my view. he wasn't signed to be a goalscorer, he's never going to be a twenty a season goalscorer. that man was supposed to be morientes and / or cissé.

 

crouch's positives outweigh his negatives. get the right type of partner alongside him and we'll see the benefit.

 

He's contributed plenty when we were playing well, but then so did everyone. However we are clearly not the finished article as a team and have weak links. IMHO he is one of them. I don't see what he offers that Heskey didn't. In fact Heskey had plenty more attributes like power, pace, neck muscles, and in relative terms, he was f*cking Gerd Muller as a goalscorer.

[hideNseek]

We'll see the best out of Crouch when we get some decent wingers.

 

Crouch has fantastic ball control. His only fault in my opinion is when he has chances he doesn't just go hell for leather, seems to try and tap the ball in instead of smacking it.

[Ombudsam]

niall quinn's article is excellent. i agree entirely with that.

 

 

Quinn continues to demonstrate he has a good ability at assessing football & footballers, his article is spot on.

 

Quinn's article isn't without merit but Crouch is his personal crusad as he sees himself in Crouch. It skews his views somewhat. He adds needed balance though. Sort of like Michael Moore and the American right

[Maldini]

We're a better team than last season and Crouch is a big factor in that. He has helped us retain possession far far better than last season which in turn has meant our defence has been under nowhere near as much pressure.

 

I knew the story when we signed him, as soon as there was a dip in form, either from him or from the team in general, the know-it-alls would be out in force shouting their mouths off about him being a waste of money. The same people who cream themselves over Rooney are the ones most vociferous in their attacks on Crouch and yet in the last 18 months Crouch has a better goalscoring record than Rooney.

[Guest beamso]

The same people who cream themselves over Rooney are the ones most vociferous in their attacks on Crouch and yet in the last 18 months Crouch has a better goalscoring record than Rooney.

 

Since the start of the 2004/2005 season Rooney has scored more goals than Crouch.

[Maldini]

Since the start of the 2004/2005 season Rooney has scored more goals than Crouch.

He's played more games though, Crouch has a better goals per games record

[Guest roger]

He's played more games though, Crouch has a better goals per games record

 

Morientes has played 51 times with a return of 9 goals.

 

Thats a goal every 5.66 games.

 

Crouch has a ratio of 1 goal per 4.75 games.

 

Cisse has a ratio of exactly 1 goal per 4 games.

 

Garcia has a ratio of exactly 1 goal per 4 games.

 

Neil Mellor has a ratio of 1 goal per 3.67 games.

 

[across all competitions]

[Maldini]

Yeah, but Mellor and Cisse contribute nothing to the team apart from goals (Mellor's stats are spurious anyhow as he's played so few games)

 

My point is that people say Crouch will never score enough goals to merit his palce in the team, but they'd happily spend £30m tomorrow if Rooney said he wanted to come here. Crouch's contribution to our improvement has gone above many reds' heads.

 

By the way my stats above relate to the time since Rooney joined United.