The role of our full-backs

[Rory Fitzgerald]

A couple of weeks ago, I had a look at some of the stats of our full-backs, mainly because of the Leicester game as a whole and specifically Milner's role in the first goal and how wide he was. So I had a look at his positioning during that game and from there, a look at the games up to that point. I have put together some screenshots and stats which appear to show that our full backs are playing a very important role for us. In fact, until the Hull game, no Liverpool player had more touches of the ball than James Milner !

 

Below are some screenshots which I have put in spoilers as it can get messy if theres lots of them in one post.

 

 

• Goals: The similarity between the opening goals against Leicester and Hull i.e. Milner feeding the ball infield to Firmino/Coutinho, the striker making the diagonal run to open space inside for the runner to exploit and in the Leicester game, score - and in the Hull game, make the pass into Lallana.

 

 

 

 

 

 

• Milner's Positioning: The Arsenal game is included to see Moreno and then Milner against Spurs, Leicester and Chelsea. The striking things are that there are plenty of touches very high and very wide for a right footed midfielder. Whilst this kind of player would naturally like to come inside, he has been very disciplined in holding his position.

 

 

 

 

 

 

• Clyne & Milner: That weekend I also had a look at Utd's full backs as they were at home to Man City. They played Shaw and Valencia. There is contrast between Milner/Shaw on the left side and how wide their touches are (midfielder vs natural left back). The difference is not so much on the right side in terms of the wide attacking touches but this is comparing a full back against a player that is a more natural winger.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

• Pass combinations: Up until the Hull game, no Liverpool player had more touches of the ball than Milner in those matches. Looking at the passing combinations, the link up play between the full backs and our wider midfielders is right up there. I have also circled similar combinations from the opposition in red and its not as prevalent as ours. Similarly, I have looked City's pass combinations and unsurprisingly, the ones that dominate are GK to CB's and CB's to FB's. What we are seeing is not a one-off but a consistent trend, we are using the full space of the pitch by getting our full backs involved quite a lot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

• Conclusion: It seems that both full backs are asked to get high and stay wide to offer width to stretch teams. We feed them the ball an awful lot and there is lots of link up play with the creative midfielders. Building up play down the channels rather through the middle can help pull/stretch the opposition's shape. If this happens often enough I suppose it can create space and then getting the ball to the likes of Firmino, Coutinho, Mane and Lallana will see us create chances. Having 2 steady 7 out-of-10's with the discipline to hold that shape and play intelligent passes seems to be suiting us rather than rampaging full backs. If one of them got injured, it wouldn't surprise me if Henderson was asked to fill in at right back and play Milner/Clyne at left back.  

Edited September 25, 2016 by Rory Fitzgerald

[Cam]

Ten words:

 

Tackle to stop opposition scoring, put crosses in for goals.

[Rory Fitzgerald]

....and scoring penalties of course

[Cam]

Not sure about Clyne yet - in that I'll have to pointedly watch to see if my theory is right - but Milner is almost operating as a wingback. Clearly to press the ball as high as possible (plus the ability to do something with it whether it's hold, pass or cross and the common sense to get back & cover).

 

I say wingback but maybe it's more of a left-midfielder in a three. Looking at yesterday's 4-3-3 and most would put Lallana on the left of the v-shaped, narrow, midfield three but (without the benefit of a heat map) it seemed to be where Milner was a lot. If Clyne is similar then it makes our formation a 2-3-5-0. Hence the fluidity, goal sharing and a lack of oomph when Sturridge plays.

Edited September 25, 2016 by Cam

[Earl Hafler]

Milner is playing the opposition whereas I doubt Moreno gave a seconds thought about his opponents style, pace etc.

 

It affects the midfield and it's no surprise that we've looked both more composed and compact during games, although the inclusion of Matip has been influential in that regard.

[Molby]

Excellent thread Rory

 

This is what it's all about lad, keep it coming

[New York Red]

They should be numbered 2 and 3. Crucial that.

[Red]

Great analysis.

 

Klopp said full backs were very important to our style of play... And he said it with one of his steely glares so you knew he wasn't joking.

[Stevie H]

find it fascinating to see an attacking midfielder with a good brain playing as a high-starting left-back for us. and so far for me the key thing about this shift is that milner thinks and more importantly passes like an attacking midfielder still. for firmino's goal against leicester milner cut inside onto his right foot and took out 2 or 3 opponents with a threaded ball into space for firmino to be immediately on the front foot. no way in a hundred years does albie moreno attempt that pass, or indeed the vast majority of career left-backs. needed a midfielder's vision and habit to do it. so our attacks are now benefiting even more from having a very intelligent, consistent midfielder play that left-back role who goes with percentages on defending but who knows how to instigate and accelerate attacks in ways a traditional fullback doesn't. it's hugely interesting. 

[Rory Fitzgerald]

and so far for me the key thing about this shift is that milner thinks and more importantly passes like an attacking midfielder still....... so our attacks are now benefiting even more from having a very intelligent, consistent midfielder play that left-back role who goes with percentages on defending but who knows how to instigate and accelerate attacks in ways a traditional fullback doesn't.

I think that's it. The Curtis Davis piece in the other thread is also interesting. There is a lot of fluidity in our central areas but to get them space we need to use the full width of the pitch to keep opponents moving.

 

The full backs provide that width. Whilst attacking full backs might take it upon themselves to make things happen by getting around the outside, our set up seems designed to get the best out of the inside players with Milner having that insight to know what a player operating infield wants from a full back.

 

Maybe a little unfair on Moreno, but everyone knows what you're getting from our full backs and that allows the rest to play without worrying about them. If you don't know what Moreno is going to do, it can create unwanted uncertainty perhaps.

Edited September 26, 2016 by Rory Fitzgerald

[Stevie H]

it's not unfair on moreno. milner has a much higher functioning football brain than moreno and is also capable of abstract thought.

[épieur]

find it fascinating to see an attacking midfielder with a good brain playing as a high-starting left-back for us. and so far for me the key thing about this shift is that milner thinks and more importantly passes like an attacking midfielder still. for firmino's goal against leicester milner cut inside onto his right foot and took out 2 or 3 opponents with a threaded ball into space for firmino to be immediately on the front foot. no way in a hundred years does albie moreno attempt that pass, or indeed the vast majority of career left-backs. needed a midfielder's vision and habit to do it. so our attacks are now benefiting even more from having a very intelligent, consistent midfielder play that left-back role who goes with percentages on defending but who knows how to instigate and accelerate attacks in ways a traditional fullback doesn't. it's hugely interesting. 

 

Saw the same against Hull. Fullbacks dont do that.

[doug_mac]

masterstroke from klopp to put milner to left back

 

milner looks like he has played there for years

[Maldini]

Great read Rory, Milner seems to be enjoying it as well. Essentially he's doing the same things he would as a left winger but his starting position when we're attacking is 15 yards deeper and he's able to join in attacks without someone tracking him more often.

[Conrad]

Imagine if Milner had pace. He'd be world class

[Stevie H]

Great read Rory, Milner seems to be enjoying it as well. Essentially he's doing the same things he would as a left winger but his starting position when we're attacking is 15 yards deeper and he's able to join in attacks without someone tracking him more often.

I think we might have just turned the leftback position into a playmaker. He receives the ball so high up that he can go outside and put a cross over or go inside and play a pass into feet in their box. I love it.

[honourablegeorge]

Milner's done phenomenally well.  What's most interesting is that all of us that were bitching about the lack of a defensive midfield signing (and I was on of the biggest whingers about it on here) are now looking at a situation where Can can't even get into the side, never mind Grujic. Just a different way of playing. Still light at left back, but light in a "Moreno getting back in the team" sense rather than a "Moreno starting every game" sense.

[Conrad]

I thought we'd be hampered by Milner's lack of pace at LB. But he's done really well so far

[Sir Tokyo Sexwale]

impossible to be unfair on Moreno. Even saying Donald Trump is a better human being isn't unfair on Moreno.

 

Thought Clyne was a bit slow to react for the Hull goal, he's decent going forward, and decent at the back; doesn't really excel at either. Milner really gives you that confident feeling (except the ball he didn't control that went out for a corner & Hull scored from).

 

I think Milner's lack of (relative) pace doesn't matter that much because of what's in front and around him in Phil, Firmino, Mane, Sturridge, Lallana etc. When the oppo is being terrorized by them & you have options to pass into and a brain to go looking for the return ball, then the need to go belting up the wing is less

[Hassony]

Milner's done phenomenally well. What's most interesting is that all of us that were bitching about the lack of a defensive midfield signing (and I was on of the biggest whingers about it on here) are now looking at a situation where Can can't even get into the side, never mind Grujic. Just a different way of playing. Still light at left back, but light in a "Moreno getting back in the team" sense rather than a "Moreno starting every game" sense.

'All of us' ?

 

Speak for yourself

[honourablegeorge]

'All of us' ?

 

Speak for yourself

 

You're looking at a situation where Can can't get into the side. 

[Hassony]

You're looking at a situation where Can can't get into the side.

Not everyone wanted a defensive midfielder, i did want a central midfielder and we got one in Wijnaldum

[honourablegeorge]

So... you werent one of those complaiming about the lack of a defensive midfield signing then?

[surf]

impossible to be unfair on Moreno. Even saying Donald Trump is a better human being isn't unfair on Moreno.

 

Thought Clyne was a bit slow to react for the Hull goal, he's decent going forward, and decent at the back; doesn't really excel at either. Milner really gives you that confident feeling (except the ball he didn't control that went out for a corner & Hull scored from).

 

I think Milner's lack of (relative) pace doesn't matter that much because of what's in front and around him in Phil, Firmino, Mane, Sturridge, Lallana etc. When the oppo is being terrorized by them & you have options to pass into and a brain to go looking for the return ball, then the need to go belting up the wing is less

 

clyne is awesome

[JRC]

What made Phil Neal great for us - and why other supporters, and England managers didn't get him - was that, when not defending (at which he was no mug if no Maldini), he played like an extra midfielder rather than the traditional straight-line 'attacking full back' they were used to. Hence a higher regard for the brainless upfield charges of Kenny Sansom than Neal's intelligent pass and move meshing with Lee or Johnston down the right flank and interchanges with Kenny inside.

 

But Paisley was a football genius and years ahead of his time, of course.

Edited September 27, 2016 by JRC