Just back from the match

[Gunga Din]

Dunno where to even start with that tonight. first 20 minutes i thought we did ok, then for some reason our midfield started to sit progressively deeper, leaving such a big gap between midfield and the front two, we got out muscled in their half, they started passing it and all of a sudden we looked s***. defending set pieces, we have no idea. no one is going to ever tell me taking all 11 men back is tthe right thing to do. they justput all their men forward. we stand 1 man on the centre spot, and one at the half way touchline, we will take a minimum of 3 and prob 4 of their players out of the attack, giving us numerical advantage when defending, plus an outlet if we win the ball instead of an aimless clearance meaning they get the second ball and we end up defending the second phase.

 

we looked a yard slower, we looked demotivated and bereft of ideas. i cant help but think our lacklustre pre season has hampered our buildup. Villa looked fitter than us. and that is very worrying

Edited August 24, 2009 by Gunga Din

[Jarg Armani]

We struggle against teams of big lads who press us.

 

Reo Coker and Petrov won the midfield without much trouble there too, which is very worrying.

 

Agree about pre season, we can't get away with starting slowly in a league as tight as this one looks like being.

[Dan]

We need to shape up fast or its a scrap for fourth. Frightening.

[Gunga Din]

We need to shape up fast or its a scrap for fourth. Frightening.

 

4th? we'll be lucky to finish 6th playing like that

[Dan]

4th? we'll be lucky to finish 6th playing like that

 

Totally agree. The margin for error is even smaller this year with City. Awful start to the season.

[lfc003]

i cant help but think our lacklustre pre season has hampered our buildup

 

In a nutshell, Our pre season was a shambles and we've been caught out

[Magic8Ball]

Dunno where to even start with that tonight. first 20 minutes i thought we did ok, then for some reason our midfield started to sit progressively deeper, leaving such a big gap between midfield and the front two, we got out muscled in their half, they started passing it and all of a sudden we looked s***. defending set pieces, we have no idea. no one is going to ever tell me taking all 11 men back is tthe right thing to do. they justput all their men forward. we stand 1 man on the centre spot, and one at the half way touchline, we will take a minimum of 3 and prob 4 of their players out of the attack, giving us numerical advantage when defending, plus an outlet if we win the ball instead of an aimless clearance meaning they get the second ball and we end up defending the second phase.

 

we looked a yard slower, we looked demotivated and bereft of ideas. i cant help but think our lacklustre pre season has hampered our buildup. Villa looked fitter than us. and that is very worrying

No Xabi no Agger, what do you expect ? the only solution is to break with the current formation and move to 433 - with Aquilani/lucas and Gerrard as the attackers and Mash sitting deep

[scoose]

we have a big problem.

 

None of our centre halfs or centre mids are good in possession. The opposing team just closes the wingers and fullbacks down and then we have nowhere to go. Mascherano, lucas, carragher or skyrtl dont have a run or goal in them. The only reason we looked good against stoke is we scored early and it covered amultitude of sins.

 

If aquilani isnt a world beater this will be a bad season

[Cam]

I thought it was Agger that we missed the most. At least he'd come forward and smash the ball. Alonso wouldn't have made any difference. That said... this was the kind of game we used to have Garcia for; he's still to be replaced.

 

The lack of cover for Torres & Gerrard was obvious tonight. Neither were "doing it" and yet no-one to bring on.

 

Was the first goal from the freekick awarded for two players running side-by-side? That's my pet peeve at the moment; if our man had gone down first we'd have got the freekick. And for their 2nd was it a corner?

 

With Agger, Aquilani & Aurelio out I think we all would have started with that team tonight (possibly Riera in somewhere - and certainly coming on). That's the worrying thing - it was our strongest possible side and it was static & clueless. Teams have caught on to how we played last year and we haven't moved on & adapted.

[Des]

And for their 2nd was it a corner?

 

Yes it was deffo a corner but it was after 40 secs more than the allotted 1 min inj time.

[Magic8Ball]

I thought it was Agger that we missed the most. At least he'd come forward and smash the ball. Alonso wouldn't have made any difference. That said... this was the kind of game we used to have Garcia for; he's still to be replaced.

 

The lack of cover for Torres & Gerrard was obvious tonight. Neither were "doing it" and yet no-one to bring on.

 

Was the first goal from the freekick awarded for two players running side-by-side? That's my pet peeve at the moment; if our man had gone down first we'd have got the freekick. And for their 2nd was it a corner?

 

With Agger, Aquilani & Aurelio out I think we all would have started with that team tonight (possibly Riera in somewhere - and certainly coming on). That's the worrying thing - it was our strongest possible side and it was static & clueless. Teams have caught on to how we played last year and we haven't moved on & adapted.

Send for the A team eh? - I'm not being negative but this season I'll be happy with qualifying for the CL, winning a major cup and the yanks NOT sacking Rafa. Without Agger and Alonso (more A's) we have no link between the defense and midfield. The CH's got away with being poor ball players because of Xabi, well he's gone and they can't hide anymore.

Agger's often injured so we need another ball playing CH or we're in serious trouble! I certainly don't see Mash developing that side of his game and becoming more xabi like.

 

Teams know without Xabi we're more easily put under pressure and they're doing that. We may need to move to 433 for some games ( dropping Mash for Leiva )

 

Rafa basically has to work out his team and formation again, so I'll be glad with a Cup this year

[Farmer's Tan]

Send for the A team eh? - I'm not being negative but this season I'll be happy with qualifying for the CL, winning a major cup and the yanks NOT sacking Rafa. Without Agger and Alonso (more A's) we have no link between the defense and midfield. The CH's got away with being poor ball players because of Xabi, well he's gone and they can't hide anymore.

Agger's often injured so we need another ball playing CH or we're in serious trouble! I certainly don't see Mash developing that side of his game and becoming more xabi like.

 

Teams know without Xabi we're more easily put under pressure and they're doing that. We may need to move to 433 for some games ( dropping Mash for Leiva )

 

Rafa basically has to work out his team and formation again, so I'll be glad with a Cup this year

and there is our whole problem,being happy to get 4th and champions league because its that money which keeps the yanks on the club.i believe now that a season with us out of the champs league would go someway to moving the owners out.Rafa leaving then they have to bring in someone and wtf do they know about managers?not having the money to cover the debt will force a move of some description,its ok saying they will sell players which wouldn't be any surprise to anyone really but then the next season what chance would there be of us making 4th and champs league and that all important money we need.the sky could fall in and the sea's could burn but as long as that cash keeps comin the longer these 2 stick around.my opinion is the only thing holding the club at the champs league level is rafa,if someone else were to come in with the money we have to spend i cant see us getting in in front of big money spenders.

[Stevie H]

and there is our whole problem,being happy to get 4th and champions league because its that money which keeps the yanks on the club.i believe now that a season with us out of the champs league would go someway to moving the owners out.Rafa leaving then they have to bring in someone and wtf do they know about managers?not having the money to cover the debt will force a move of some description,its ok saying they will sell players which wouldn't be any surprise to anyone really but then the next season what chance would there be of us making 4th and champs league and that all important money we need.the sky could fall in and the sea's could burn but as long as that cash keeps comin the longer these 2 stick around.my opinion is the only thing holding the club at the champs league level is rafa,if someone else were to come in with the money we have to spend i cant see us getting in in front of big money spenders.

and at the same time be f***ing catastrophic.

[Farmer's Tan]

and at the same time be f***ing catastrophic.

well we can slowly fall away with each of us knowing that this is whats happening hoping that some moron comes in and spends twice or more than what the club is worth to buy it and then another chunk on a stadium(when i say moron i mean a person would have to be one to spend that type of money)its just not going to happen.the club is worth what?about 250mill the debt is about 400ish mill and what would a stadium cost?there is never going to be a stadium with these guys in charge.so short term yeah missing the champs league is catastrophic but what would you call the direction the club is going in in the long term then?

 

i know this is the wrong thread but how does anyone think these guy will just up and leave while they are still making money,look at what you guys did with cohen,hit him where it hurts and it worked,i know its a completely different animal but it all boils down to the same thing,money.

[Stevie H]

well we can slowly fall away with each of us knowing that this is whats happening hoping that some moron comes in and spends twice or more than what the club is worth to buy it and then another chunk on a stadium(when i say moron i mean a person would have to be one to spend that type of money)its just not going to happen.the club is worth what?about 250mill the debt is about 400ish mill and what would a stadium cost?there is never going to be a stadium with these guys in charge.so short term yeah missing the champs league is catastrophic but what would you call the direction the club is going in in the long term then?

 

i know this is the wrong thread but how does anyone think these guy will just up and leave while they are still making money,look at what you guys did with cohen,hit him where it hurts and it worked,i know its a completely different animal but it all boils down to the same thing,money.

think missing out on champions league football could do nothing so much as speed the process of decline up. without the CL money to prop us up we'd have to sell players, something which is always the start of any consistent downward spiral - cf. leeds.

[Magic8Ball]

we're in a pickle no doubt. My biggest fear right now is the only think keeping Rafa here is the dream of winning the league. IF/once he does that I don't expect the yanks will be able to keep him here

[Dan]

We've also conceded 5 goals this season - none of them from open play (apart from Ekoto at Spurs but still from a FK)

 

Too many daft challenges in and around our penalty box. Happened against Spurs, Stoke and Villa. Jittery on the ball, unable to keep possession and diving in all over the place. That combined with our inability to defend set pieces and our achilles heel from last season is causing us some major damage again.

Edited August 25, 2009 by DS77

[Stevie H]

We've also conceded 5 goals this season - none of them from open play (apart from Ekoto at Spurs but still from a FK)

 

Too many daft challenges in and around our penalty box. Happened against Spurs, Stoke and Villa. Jittery on the ball, unable to keep possession and diving in all over the place. That combined with our inability to defend set pieces and our achilles heel from last season is causing us some major damage again.

think we're nervous as f*** all round without alonso there to set the patterns of play, slow it dowen when required, speed it up when required, to dictate the game. every game alonso missed when he was with us we were generally awful at keeping possession.

[cymrococh]

think we're nervous as f*** all round without alonso there to set the patterns of play, slow it dowen when required, speed it up when required, to dictate the game. every game alonso missed when he was with us we were generally awful at keeping possession.

We didn't handle set-pieces well last season either.

 

Got to look at the centre-halves and the coaching staff for that.

[Stevie H]

We didn't handle set-pieces well last season either.

 

Got to look at the centre-halves and the coaching staff for that.

we've just never replaced sami in that regard have we? probably fair to say that you won't win the league title without at least one aerially dominant centre back.

[richwilks]

I thought we looked better when Gerrard dropped into the middle and we played 2 upfront. The trouble is that Torres aside our other strikers are s***.

 

Rafa seriously needs to look at bringing someone into play alongside Torres at least until Alonso is fit. Gerrard was on the fringes of the game last night until he dropped in next to Masch.

 

Lucas was poor last night, he got his head down after a few mistakes and he shouldn't be doing that, he needs to be stronger mentally than that.

 

The biggest problem we had last night was that the two players we brought on to change the game were Voronin and Babel. f***ing abysmal. We should definitely have been in for Negredo.

 

Next game we need to go 4-4-2 and really start having a go, Torres was too isolated last night and looked better when he had someone up with him, although Voronin was nothing special and was dropping way too deep at points he did at least take one of the defenders away from Torres who had 3 around him at points.

 

4-4-2 next game, put Babel up top with Torres and see how he does in the position he claims to be the best in.

 

I presume either Riera is carrying a knock still or is going to be sold shortly. Why the hell wasn't he involved?

 

Beaten 3-1 by a poor Villa side is disappointing but it's early in the season and we now need to put together a run of results and we are capable of doing that.

[Stevie H]

Rafa seriously needs to look at bringing someone into play alongside Torres at least until Alonso is fit. Gerrard was on the fringes of the game last night until he dropped in next to Masch.

wishful bloody thinking there.

[Chili Palmer]

I thought we looked better when Gerrard dropped into the middle and we played 2 upfront. The trouble is that Torres aside our other strikers are s***.

 

Rafa seriously needs to look at bringing someone into play alongside Torres at least until Alonso is fit. Gerrard was on the fringes of the game last night until he dropped in next to Masch.

Lucas was poor last night, he got his head down after a few mistakes and he shouldn't be doing that, he needs to be stronger mentally than that.

 

The biggest problem we had last night was that the two players we brought on to change the game were Voronin and Babel. f***ing abysmal. We should definitely have been in for Negredo.

 

Next game we need to go 4-4-2 and really start having a go, Torres was too isolated last night and looked better when he had someone up with him, although Voronin was nothing special and was dropping way too deep at points he did at least take one of the defenders away from Torres who had 3 around him at points.

 

4-4-2 next game, put Babel up top with Torres and see how he does in the position he claims to be the best in.

 

I presume either Riera is carrying a knock still or is going to be sold shortly. Why the hell wasn't he involved?

 

Beaten 3-1 by a poor Villa side is disappointing but it's early in the season and we now need to put together a run of results and we are capable of doing that.

 

wish he'd stayed on the fringes, that penalty was stupidity personified.

[Dan]

Gerrard was poor start to finish. Sloppy passes in the first half and ill discipline in the second half. He's not looked right in all three games imo. Neither has Torres. Another massive factor in our sh*te start.

[richwilks]

wish he'd stayed on the fringes, that penalty was stupidity personified.

 

 

I can't see what he was even trying to achieve there. Absolutely nowhere near the ball, it was just unfortunate that the bloke he was trying to tackle was nowhere near the ball as well. Ha ha.