Is this true?

[Fagan]

apoligies if this is elsewhere, i looked and didnt find it. is it true our fans were shouting '2-0 to the murders' as is reported below?

 

 

Link

 

 

 

Before kick-off at Goodison Park on Saturday, officials from Everton and Liverpool gathered on the pitch to release 200 purple balloons under a banner that said: “Liverpool Unites”. As most of the balloons stayed in their sack, you wondered whether someone was trying to tell the local newspaper that their campaign to unite red and blue might struggle to get off the ground.

 

There has been a certain amount of revisionism on Merseyside in recent years about the “myth” of the friendly derby. According to some, the convivial Everton-Liverpool Cup Finals of the 1980s caught them at a moment of weakness and, had it not been that the city was being downtrodden by the government, the two sets of fans would not have stood side by side at Wembley chanting “Merseyside, Merseyside” and “Are you watching, Manchester?”

 

However superficial that sense of Scouse solidarity may or may not have been at the time, that historical context is inevitable when charting the deterioration of a rivalry that has reached the gutter. On Saturday we had all the usual bile (the chilling “Murderers” chants, the gestures to signify the deaths at Heysel and Hillsborough, the distasteful abuse of Joleon Lescott and of Steven Gerrard’s family) and then, most depressingly of all, the new and hopefully short-lived phenomenon of Liverpool supporters chanting “2-0 to the murderers”.

 

Jamie Carragher, born an Evertonian, but now the quintessential Liverpudlian, uses his experience on both sides of the divide to make some searing observations on the rivalry in his autobiography. He uses words such as “sinister”, “vile” and “inexcusable”. Heaven only knows what Carragher made of the moment on Saturday when Liverpool supporters stooped lower than a snake’s belly with their own take on the “Murderers” chant. According to some in the away end, it was a post-ironic take on Everton supporters’ perceived obsession with Heysel and its supposed repercussions for their club as they went into decline shortly after English clubs were banned from European competition. Whatever, it sounded truly awful.

 

There is no humour any more. Where once there was respect and gentle mickey-taking (“He’s fat, he’s s***, he’ s never f***ing fit, Peter Reid”), now there are personal attacks on men such as Gerrard based not on humour but on vicious and unfounded rumour. One less offensive rumour is that the Liverpool captain had a vest declaring “I’m the daddy” to show off in case he scored his 100th goal for the club on Saturday. That would have shut them up, but not, you suspect, for long.

[Mike]

it is true and he's totally missed the point and needs a word.

for f***ing years those mongrels and manc t***s have been singing that at us, we sang it back ironically to shut the f*****s up (and it worked). first time we've ever done it and he's seen fit to put it to print, never a word said in the press for those t***s doing it for the past 10 years,

[Guest Ant]

I usually like Oliver Kay, but there would be no need for the 'x-0' to the murderers retort if Evertonians hadn't been calling us that for years now.

 

He's missed the point well and truly there. What about them c**** singing about Michael Sheilds? I remember the other year during the 0-0 at home and Rafa called Everton a small club...I was so incensed that I rang up BBC Radio Merseyside on the football phone in. I said something along the lines of 'What right do Evertonians have to 'demand' the apology of an innocent, witty and probably true statement about their club, when there fans sing songs about Hillsborough and Michael Shields more times than they do Tim Cahill?'

 

The t*** then proceeded to change the subject to the 'Good 'Arl days of Footie'

Edited September 29, 2008 by Ant

[Fagan]

it is true and he's totally missed the point and needs a word.

for f***ing years those mongrels and manc t***s have been singing that at us, we sang it back ironically to shut the f*****s up (and it worked). first time we've ever done it and he's seen fit to put it to print, never a word said in the press for those t***s doing it for the past 10 years,

 

 

has anyone written to him i wonder, it does seem totally unbalanced and out of context. although i am slightly uncomfortable at the thought of singing that myself, but i understand fully the thought process behind it

[Falconhoof]

I must have missed all of the articles condemning Man U fans for their murderers, Heysel and Hillsborough taunts. I must have missed Oliver Kay slamming Everton supporters for their behaviour over the dead of their own city.

 

I'm not even sure that what he's claiming happened. Nobody I know has said anything about it. If it did happen then its surely designed to shut Everton fans up isn't it ?

Just as whenUnited fans started to chant 'where's your famous Munich song' to us, they had us bang to rights.

[Fagan]

the oddest thing is that it s one of the shortest articles hes ever written, it looks lke it took about 3 minutes to write. he could have done a double page spread on this topic and yet didnt.

 

In those circumstances you have to questin his motives, journalists are supposed to seek out the truth, he clearly hasnt here and he must know it.

[smithdown]

I must have missed all of the articles condemning Man U fans for their murderers, Heysel and Hillsborough taunts. I must have missed Oliver Kay slamming Everton supporters for their behaviour over the dead of their own city.

 

 

They don't hear any of the manc songs about Hillsbrough/Heysel, which is weird cos they sing them every week.

[fyds]

He's really missed the point there. It was ironic - that much he half-got - but doesn't comment on the years of other abuse everything from personal, racial and mocking the dead of their own city.

 

I really, really hope those feckers go down this season - I don't care about the derby anymore - friendly or otherwise.

[Bigal]

I usually like Oliver Kay, but there would be no need for the 'x-0' to the murderers retort if Evertonians hadn't been calling us that for years now.

 

He's missed the point well and truly there. What about them c**** singing about Michael Sheilds? I remember the other year during the 0-0 at home and Rafa called Everton a small club...I was so incensed that I rang up BBC Radio Merseyside on the football phone in. I said something along the lines of 'What right do Evertonians have to 'demand' the apology of an innocent, witty and probably true statement about their club, when there fans sing songs about Hillsborough and Michael Shields more times than they do Tim Cahill?'

 

The t*** then proceeded to change the subject to the 'Good 'Arl days of Footie'

 

seems to have forgotten the classic ditty of "Die Die Nicky Nicky Die" or who had a heart attack? who who houllier?

 

is singing about Joleon Lescott that bad??

Edited September 29, 2008 by Bigal

[Jacks Jackie Jackson]

He's right about the sickening gestures of the s**** though. Virtually every one of the loyal blue supporters leaving the stand to our left with up to 20 minutes left on the clock, felt it necessary to do a pushing motion in our direction in the hope it'd puncture our bubble. Now I don't condone our lot singing what they did (and they did it at 1-0 as well) but like Spurs taking back the "Yids" jibe or their rivals taking the old 1-0-to-thee-Arsenal insult and turning it round as a gesture of defiance, it can be seen to be understandable.

[Bigal]

He's right about the sickening gestures of the s**** though. Virtually every one of the loyal blue supporters leaving the stand to our left with up to 20 minutes left on the clock, felt it necessary to do a pushing motion in our direction in the hope it'd puncture our bubble. Now I don't condone our lot singing what they did (and they did it at 1-0 as well) but like Spurs taking back the "Yids" jibe or their rivals taking the old 1-0-to-thee-Arsenal insult and turning it round as a gesture of defiance, it can be seen to be understandable.

 

excellent point about spurs, they refer to themselves and their players as "yids"

 

I havent seen the outcry on that

[Will]

first time we've ever done it and he's seen fit to put it to print, never a word said in the press for those t***s doing it for the past 10 years,

Certainly isn't the first time we've done it. I remember it at the 3-1 Christmas-time game when Crouch scored

[5InIstanbul]

Well I'm going to go out on a limb and expect a flaming.

 

Irony or not, it's a bloody stupid thing for supporters of LFC to be chanting.

 

We rightly fight tooth and nail for justice and the memory of Hillsborough and indeed Heysel, this can do nothing but harm.

 

I dont care what the press report or dont report about our opponents chants, we are better than that. It's blindingly obvious that this would be picked up by the press at some point and jumped on.

 

Even in the heat of battle I'd rather us be above that. Don't get me wrong, I understand why we've done it, but I think it harms us.

[Bigal]

Certainly isn't the first time we've done it. I remember it at the 3-1 Christmas-time game when Crouch scored

 

I remember that also.

 

f*** me that game was cold as well

Edited September 29, 2008 by Bigal

[yellow jumper]

Well I'm going to go out on a limb and expect a flaming.

 

Irony or not, it's a bloody stupid thing for supporters of LFC to be chanting.

 

We rightly fight tooth and nail for justice and the memory of Hillsborough and indeed Heysel, this can do nothing but harm.

 

agree. and i don't think he's missed this point at all.

Edited September 29, 2008 by george lees

[matlfc]

Well I'm going to go out on a limb and expect a flaming.

 

Irony or not, it's a bloody stupid thing for supporters of LFC to be chanting.

 

We rightly fight tooth and nail for justice and the memory of Hillsborough and indeed Heysel, this can do nothing but harm.

 

I dont care what the press report or dont report about our opponents chants, we are better than that. It's blindingly obvious that this would be picked up by the press at some point and jumped on.

 

Even in the heat of battle I'd rather us be above that. Don't get me wrong, I understand why we've done it, but I think it harms us.

 

I thought the same but it was also obvious we were being sarcastic. After years of hearing the same s*** sang to us it wasnt really that bad. Like you say tho i wish we would have rose above it.

[Bigal]

I thought the same but it was also obvious we were being sarcastic. After years of hearing the same s*** sang to us it wasnt really that bad. Like you say tho i wish we would have rose above it.

 

To be honest, it getting worse and worse, how long can you stay on the moral high ground?

[WillG]

Well I'm going to go out on a limb and expect a flaming.

 

Irony or not, it's a bloody stupid thing for supporters of LFC to be chanting.

 

We rightly fight tooth and nail for justice and the memory of Hillsborough and indeed Heysel, this can do nothing but harm.

 

I dont care what the press report or dont report about our opponents chants, we are better than that. It's blindingly obvious that this would be picked up by the press at some point and jumped on.

 

Even in the heat of battle I'd rather us be above that. Don't get me wrong, I understand why we've done it, but I think it harms us.

 

nail . on . head

[Guest Ant]

Well I'm going to go out on a limb and expect a flaming.

 

Irony or not, it's a bloody stupid thing for supporters of LFC to be chanting.

 

We rightly fight tooth and nail for justice and the memory of Hillsborough and indeed Heysel, this can do nothing but harm.

 

I dont care what the press report or dont report about our opponents chants, we are better than that. It's blindingly obvious that this would be picked up by the press at some point and jumped on.

 

Even in the heat of battle I'd rather us be above that. Don't get me wrong, I understand why we've done it, but I think it harms us.

 

Have you been to a Derby?

[Snookie]

Well I'm going to go out on a limb and expect a flaming.

 

Irony or not, it's a bloody stupid thing for supporters of LFC to be chanting.

 

We rightly fight tooth and nail for justice and the memory of Hillsborough and indeed Heysel, this can do nothing but harm.

 

I dont care what the press report or dont report about our opponents chants, we are better than that. It's blindingly obvious that this would be picked up by the press at some point and jumped on.

 

Even in the heat of battle I'd rather us be above that. Don't get me wrong, I understand why we've done it, but I think it harms us.

 

Completely agree.

[Andy @ Allerton]

It was true and I was embarrassed by our fans singing it.

 

Our fans were also singing about Lescott being the Elephant Man and 'Munich.. Munich..' came out against Saha.

 

Can't see how some of our fans can complain about bile from the Mancs or Everton if we're going to stoop to their level.

 

But that's just my personal opinion.

[5InIstanbul]

Have you been to a Derby?

 

Plenty thanks but is that relevant?

[Guest Ant]

It was true and I was embarrassed by our fans singing it.

 

Our fans were also singing about Lescott being the Elephant Man and 'Munich.. Munich..' came out against Saha.

 

Can't see how some of our fans can complain about bile from the Mancs or Everton if we're going to stoop to their level.

 

But that's just my personal opinion.

 

Depends really.

 

Have you ever been to a game where we have sung about Lescott when we haven't been playing Everton?

 

Plenty thanks but is that relevant?

 

Yes, because it's easy to say 'We shouldn't say this' or 'we shouldn't say that' when people don't experience the bile, anger and bitterness from our blue cousins both when they play us, and when they play in Europe or any other team.

 

2-0 to the murderers is a sarcastic retort and as others have mentioned, he has missed the point.

[Bigal]

Depends really.

 

Have you ever been to a game where we have sung about Lescott when we haven't been playing Everton?

 

excellent point.

 

I havent heard these songs anywhere else.

[5InIstanbul]

Yes, because it's easy to say 'We shouldn't say this' or 'we shouldn't say that' when people don't experience the bile, anger and bitterness from our blue cousins both when they play us, and when they play in Europe or any other team.

 

2-0 to the murderers is a sarcastic retort and as others have mentioned, he has missed the point.

 

Read my post again, I say I understood why it was done.

 

I've also been to many games against the Mancs and heard plenty of the same.

 

But do you know what, saracstic or not, I'd feel sick to the stomach if that sh*t came out of my mouth. I can turn into a demented nutter like the next man at those games in particular but I couldnt bring myself to spout that, no way.

 

Each to their own.

Edited September 29, 2008 by GEH007