SoS

[Andy @ Allerton]

I was just wondering SoS has been going for a while - what is the general feeling?

 

Hopefully any feedback can be used to improve the group.

Edited August 30, 2008 by Andy @ Allerton

[Stevie H]

not sure what you hope to achieve with such a narrow poll really andy.

[Andy @ Allerton]

Just want to see what the general feeling is.

[Mike]

why?

[Bromage]

I think it's a fair question to ask of members on an independent website. Any group which holds itself up to represent the fans is entitled to be scrutinised by those same people. The poll won't make any difference to the actions of the SOS but it does at least let people here express an opinion.

 

If however the criticism is of the options for voting then by all means list some alternatives and then Andy may decide to change them and rerun the poll. That's his free choice.........

[Mike]

and do what the information gathered though? that's what i was asking.

Edited August 30, 2008 by Mike

[5InIstanbul]

Without wishing to start world war 3, I do wonder whether any organisation whose ultimate aim in this day and age is supporter ownership can have any credibility.

 

The model is fine if we want to play in the Ryman League but as one of the top sides in Europe, in the modern game, it's simply nonsensical to try and create.

 

They should stick to a single issue of change of ownership and focus everything on that, IMO.

[hideNseek]

I voted the first one. For all the moaning about them at least there trying.

[Mike]

Without wishing to start world war 3, I do wonder whether any organisation whose ultimate aim in this day and age is supporter ownership can have any credibility.

 

The model is fine if we want to play in the Ryman League but as one of the top sides in Europe, in the modern game, it's simply nonsensical to try and create.

 

They should stick to a single issue of change of ownership and focus everything on that, IMO.

 

how do you explain all the massive clubs in europe who do follow that model then?

[5InIstanbul]

how do you explain all the massive clubs in europe who do follow that model then?

 

All? With European success to match ours? There's only a couple of really "big" clubs that follow it and they have been that way for a long long time. My point was to try and implement it from where we are now simply cant work.

 

If we want to dick arond as a domestic and european alsoran then it might, just might be feasible. But t have the muscle to fight for honours home and abroad, no chance IMO.

Edited August 30, 2008 by GEH007

[Falconhoof]

If its fans ownership were after then there's already an organised group aiming for that. They have a detailed plan and are endorsed by people like Phil Thompson, Whelan, McAteer and Aldo.

I can't see the plan behind SOS.

[bazz]

I didn't even bother voting, because as a Liverpool supporter for over 30 years, but because I wasn't born there and might actually take a ticket away from a fan who is actually from there - Im not represented by this group.

[Gunga Din]

I more or less support what SOS are trying to do in get the current owners out. However, it has been shockingly run, with ill advised statements and seems to be splitting the fan base. the argument that they are only doing it in their spare time doesnt wash with me. Share Liverpool and AFC Liverpool are in the same boat in that respect and have been much better run.

 

For SOS to succeed, they need to concentrate on one or two things. they are spreading themselves too thinly at the minute, meaning the waters are getting muddied and contradictory stories are coming out about what they are trying to do. They also need to get someone with half a brain to do their press releases, because a good many of them have been shambolic and badly worded.

 

Their ultimate aim of fan ownership is also slightly odd, as they have not said how they intend this to happen. At least Share Liverpool have a definate plan. Is the SOS plan to let them get on with it, do all the hard work, and then latch on at the later stages? Having two organisations striving for the same thing is wrong, but at least one of those oganistations have a planned route on how they hope to do it.

 

If SOS stick to the plan in getting the owners out, (for which i believe they were ultimately set up) and stick to that, stick to hard and fast facts instead of opinion and speculation in their press releases regarding the owners, and stop trying to comment on every little thing the club does from fancards to signing fullbacks, i believe they can be a major player in ridding the club of the parasites that now run it. I also think someone should be given remit to answer the various questions that are popping up on forums. At the minute, statements are made, but then when someone questions anything, no one answers it, even when they email the SOS site, and so people ar left to interpret things for themselves, and may often get the wrong idea of what SOS actually meant, which leads to SOS supporters getting all abusive towards people who ask the questions, which in turn causes resentment towards the organisation.

[Mike]

All? With European success to match ours? There's only a couple of really "big" clubs that follow it and they have been that way for a long long time. My point was to try and implement it from where we are now simply cant work.

 

If we want to dick arond as a domestic and european alsoran then it might, just might be feasible. But t have the muscle to fight for honours home and abroad, no chance IMO.

 

well you didn't say any of that.

im sure you are aware that most of the bundesliga have this model, as do the spanish giants.

[Gunga Din]

well you didn't say any of that.

im sure you are aware that most of the bundesliga have this model, as do the spanish giants.

 

 

most of the bundesliga play in council owned stadium which they share. most of the bundesliga are also s****, and have no money tobuy the top players. the spanish teams that have this model have had it from the year dot, since long before football became a cash cow for billionaires. However, if you want to point us all in the direction of a European giant who have recently adopted this approach and made it work, i'd be extremely interested and have a look.

[5InIstanbul]

well you didn't say any of that.

im sure you are aware that most of the bundesliga have this model, as do the spanish giants.

 

I thought my use of the phrase "try and create" was pretty self explanatory. Clearly not.

[5InIstanbul]

most of the bundesliga play in council owned stadium which they share. most of the bundesliga are also s****, and have no money tobuy the top players. the spanish teams that have this model have had it from the year dot, since long before football became a cash cow for billionaires. However, if you want to point us all in the direction of a European giant who have recently adopted this approach and made it work, i'd be extremely interested and have a look.

 

Which was exactly my point mate.

 

I was obviously being too subtle for some others

[PrittStick]

I will risk the wrath of many by saying that I simply don’t see the point in them.

 

At least with ShareLFC there is an action plan, an outcome, a solution. At least they have an idea on how things will progress. How realistic that is remains to be seen but it’s a template used by most of the German League and used by two of the most successful clubs in Spain.

 

Why CAN’T it work? Why IS it unrealistic?

 

SOS seem intent only to make noise and get the owners out. Then what? What next? Objective met?

 

What if they don’t like the next owners? And the next? If I were a potential owner I might actually take my business elsewhere if only to avoid the potential aggro of The Fans not liking one of my decisions…

 

“We demand the immediate resignation of these liars or we will protest.”

 

Yes. Okay. Because they're just going to sheepishly hold a hand up and say "Sorry, sorry, let me just pack my things."

 

How on Earth is this going to work when the only language that people like Hicks and Gillette understand is money? Living thousands of miles away they don’t have to listen to the protests, they don’t have to see the banners.

 

They can turn a blind eye to the fact that people hate them. They can put some wax ear plugs in their ears.

 

What they can’t turn a blind eye to is their own greed though. That’s why the sticks and stones and noise approach of SOS is not going to work, IMHO.

Edited August 30, 2008 by PrittStick

[MFletcher]

Agree with the sentiment, but statements from them on the Thomas Cook deal have lamented the potential loss of tickets available to 'local' people, and their statement on Degen/Alves was extremely ill-advised. I'm also at a loss as to what they're doing at the minute. Are they a fans group? Are they attempting to change football itself? Or are they solely there to force the Yanks out? To me, they've become a fans' group angry at the ills of modern football, as opposed to being a supporters' group aimed at removing the owners ASAP. The waters have been muddied, and I daresay statements have been released about certain things without proper research occuring.

 

I'm also confused as to how they've organised cheaper coach travel. Is it subsidised? If not, how have they managed to negotiate a deal cheaply? I've asked before, but have never received a proper answer.

[kop205]

I didn't even bother voting, because as a Liverpool supporter for over 30 years, but because I wasn't born there and might actually take a ticket away from a fan who is actually from there - Im not represented by this group.

 

Edited because I can't be arsed getting into an argument about this again when I and others have explained at length elsewhere why all it takes is a bit of common sense to see the valid points underlying the admittedly ill-advised comments made by SoS about the Thomas Cook deal, and when people like bazz conspicuosly offer no response to those explanations because they would much rather rush to take offence and sob into their Liverworld bags (*) than actually admit that they might be overreacting a bit to one statement.

 

(*) that bit is a joke by the way before you accuse me of being anti-OOT.

Edited August 30, 2008 by kop205

[Gunga Din]

f***ing grow up.

 

 

this is exactly the sort of response i was talking about in my earlier post. instead of someone from SOS clarifying something, you get that sort of post, and it is people like you posting like that which is doing more damage than good to the SOS cause.

[Guest SpiritualWarrier]

Putting a poll on YNWA asking what they think of SOS?

 

Whatever next a poll on red cafe asking what they think of Jamie Carragher?

 

If you put a poll on RAWK, TLW, OTK You would get a totally different response.

[Kaizer Sauze]

I was just wondering SoS has been going for a while - what is the general feeling?

 

Hopefully any feedback can be used to improve the group.

 

 

Talk about a loaded poll Andy

 

Then again, it seems that you've had a problem with SOS from day one.

 

It also seems that, if i'm honest, the biggest problem that some people on here have is that it wasn't "their" idea, and have had their superfan ego bruised, obviously this is only a minority, one thing this site has always had is intelliengent and reasoned debate, but sadly this is often derailed by the previously mentioned minority.

 

Empty vessels and that.

 

There is also this competely imbecelic notion that SOS are anti-oot, borne out of one comment about local fans that was given to the Echo, which, surprise, surprise, is a local paper.

 

Obviously the people who run the union have got things wrong, but they have also got a hell of things right, it is also clear they have fair amount of credibility right across the board, from media, dubai, right through to the upper echelons of the club.

 

Not bad for a gang of aimless scall's with nothing better to do, eh?

Edited August 30, 2008 by Kaizer Sauze

[kop205]

this is exactly the sort of response i was talking about in my earlier post. instead of someone from SOS clarifying something, you get that sort of post, and it is people like you posting like that which is doing more damage than good to the SOS cause.

 

Which is why I edited it, and if you read my edited post you'll see that I've actually explained a great many times why all it actually takes is a bit of common sense to see the point that they were making. Yes, some clarification would have been helpful but it was hardly essentiel given how obvious their underlying point surely was.

 

Thing is, when you actually post clarification or explanation, (like I did Here for example) the likes of bazz are nowhere to be seen, whether it be to engage in any sort of sensible debate in response to the points made or to say 'actually, you know what, I can see what they meant now'.

 

Instead, they just post snidey, self-indulgent stuff like the one he put in this thread. The 'f***ing grow up' was a frustarted response to the fact that effectively, certain people have heard that one comment and are now basically doing nothing other than going so an accusation of a lack of maturity isn't entirely ill-founded either.

 

We all know that you are no fan of SoS (and as I've said repeatedly, I'm not even a member let alone a spokesperson for them though I am prepared to give them time and the benefit of the doubt) but at least with you there a range of concerns that you are prepared to air in a coherent and mature manner and engage in debate.

 

The grinding negativity about everything and anything gets a bit wearying at times but I respect the depth of thought behind your views and hell, further down the line, may even end up sharing them. What I don't respect is people who's entire anti-SoS agenda is based on one article in the Echo and who keep on bringing it out as a stick to beat them with whilst ignoring those who have tried to clarify what was meant.

Edited August 30, 2008 by kop205

[Gunga Din]

Talk about a loaded poll Andy

 

Then again, it seems that you've had a problem with SOS from day one.

 

It also seems that, if i'm honest, the biggest problem that some people on here have is that it wasn't "their" idea, and have had their superfan ego bruised, obviously this is only a minority, one thing this site has always had is intelliengent and reasoned debate, but sadly this is often derailed by the previously mentioned minority.

 

Empty vessels and that.

 

There is also this competely imbecelic notion that SOS are anti-oot, borne out of one comment about local fans that was given to the Echo, which, surprise, surprise, is a local paper.

 

Obviously the people who run the union have got things wrong, but they have also got a hell of things right, it is also clear they have fair amount of credibility right across the board, from media, dubai, right through to the upper echelons of the club.

 

Not bad for a gang of aimless scall's with nothing better to do, eh?

 

its not a loaded poll. What options would you give?

 

the "imbecelic notion" that SOS is anti-oot comes from an SOS statement, nothing else. why wasnt it retracted and clarified? its a bit cheeky asking a Liverpool fan fom say Norway for a tenner, then having a rant because they are coming to games at the expense of local kids.

 

Maybe if SOS spent as much time addressing peoples concerns rather than accusing them of anything from being jealous they never thought of it to being on the side of Hicks and Gillet, then more people would be supportive.