Mascherano

[Elisha_Scott]

I am struggling to see what all the fuss is about. He works hard and wins tackles, but, he offers nothing offensively, he doesn't keep the ball too well and he is really slow. I am not just judging on yesterdays performance because everyone was s***e.

I think he is more suited to playing in a 5 man midfield where he has 2 good attacking players to give the ball to with a short ball. In a 4 where he is required to create more he doesn't convince me.

Edited September 30, 2007 by Elisha_Scott

[Guest Lennon]

So which other performances are you judging him on?

 

Can't be any from last season.

 

As for offering nothing offensively, he's a defensive holding midfielder, what were you expecting?

 

Gerrard is the biggest problem in that respect. He's in another of his "England golden boy" fazes

Edited September 30, 2007 by Lennon

[Guest snez1]

off the boil in the last few games but he's top class. he performs so well in the big games against the likes of chelsea and arsenal, maybe if the offensive midfielders we're producing more we wouldn't be nitpicking about masch who has been ecellent since he came here. best holding midfielder in the league.

[CarraLegend]

He's class but because of the way he plays and his position he needs a great player to play against so he can be great aswell. He's still won tackles which have lead to goals yesterday and against Derby so he's still valuable against s***e but I think he needs good attacking midfielders ala Kaka against him to be at his best.

 

Invaluable in big games but can do without him against most of the s***e in this League.

Edited September 30, 2007 by CarraLegend

[Elisha_Scott]

So which other performances are you judging him on?

 

Can't be any from last season.

 

As for offering nothing offensively, he's a defensive holding midfielder, what were you expecting?

 

Gerrard is the biggest problem in that respect. He's in another of his "England golden boy" fazes

 

His other performances that he has put in for LFC, I am judging him how he is as a player.

I know what type of player he is, if he plays that position his ball retention has to be much, much better than it is. Didi Hamann-esque.

I am not picking holes in a particular performance, I have watched him in virtually all the games he has played in for us and I am not convinced he is anything special.

[Guest Lennon]

His ball retention is fine, one of the best parts of his game, he's proved that many times since he's been here. He's just not at the top of his game.

 

I was hoping this was just a fishing trip as I can't believe people are already starting to question Mascherano. He's one of the best young midfielders in the game.

[Elisha_Scott]

His ball retention is fine, one of the best parts of his game, he's proved that many times since he's been here. He's just not at the top of his game.

 

I was hoping this was just a fishing trip as I can't believe people are already starting to question Mascherano. He's one of the best young midfielders in the game.

 

He gives it away loads. Why would it be a fishing trip? I am not 'questioning him already' I have watched him since he signed and have formed an opinion.

He doesn't have enough to his game to be called one of the best. He can tackle and he works his plums off, but I dont think thats enough.

[mattster]

I think he's a genuine world-class holding midfielder, and would have him in our best 11, no problem. He is like Makalele and Didi, two of the best of their type in the last 10 years, I'd say. Isn't that good enough? What are the alternatives? I think your point about Mascherano being best suited by a 5-man midfield is a fair one, but I'll always find a place for him in a 4-man when the alternatives in the middle are Xabi-Gerrard or Momo-Gerrard axis. For me, he allows Gerrard the freedom with which he likes to play, the freedom with which he can really hurt the opposition and, I don't know about you, but I like plain old 4-4-2 with the players we've got at our disposal.

It's a good talking point, but i don't think there is a right or wrong answer to this at the moment, we'll probably know more come May, I reckon.

[smicer07]

Absolute stinker of a thread.

[RafaShanks]

He like a Mini me Didi, minus the packet of 20.

[Guest Kaizer]

I think he is more suited to playing in a 5 man midfield where he has 2 good attacking players to give the ball to with a short ball. In a 4 where he is required to create more he doesn't convince me.

 

This is one of the points I made in the thread about Mascherano earlier in the week as well, just in other words and in another context.

 

My point is, even if Mascherano is the best defensive midfielder in the world, should he start most of our matches or is having the best player in this exact position something a team happily can do without?

 

Personally I think Alonso-Gerrard should be our first choice partnership in CM and neither of them are the worlds best defensive midfielder if you follow my logic.

 

For me the DM position is a position that only teams that play a certain system should rely on as one of the most vital parts of their set up, we dont play such a system and we dont have the quality needed in other positions to justify using the the best defensive midfielder in the world most of the time, unless Gerrard is moved wide.

[Guest Lennon]

Absolute stinker of a thread.

 

You're not kidding.

 

I was hoping someone would start a thread about the captain and his stinking, inconsistent form and general apathy at playing for us, which has constantly hampererd Rafa in his time here. But that would be silly.

[Lee W]

Accounting for his age, in that position, he is absolute quality.

 

Think he is a bit more ambitious than Didi in his pass selection and therefore has a tendancy to give it away sometimes, but that should improve with experience.

[Guest Sabre]

I think Masch is fantastic at what he does but I think he's been brought in to keep us tight when we're up against the very best teams, not against the majority of teams we play in the league. Playing against Chelsea in the EC semi is perfect for him, or away games against our rivals, but if we want to go and batter teams at Anfield he is not the right sort of player.

 

Of course, Lennon will tell you that he dictates the tempo of the game just as well as Alonso...

[Lee W]

I was hoping someone would start a thread about the captain and his stinking, inconsistent form and general apathy at playing for us, which has constantly hampererd Rafa in his time here. But that would be silly.

 

Gerrard was absolutely on fire the season before last.

 

But this isn't about Gerrard is it ?

Edited September 30, 2007 by Lee W

[Guest Sabre]

You're not kidding.

 

I was hoping someone would start a thread about the captain and his stinking, inconsistent form and general apathy at playing for us, which has constantly hampererd Rafa in his time here. But that would be silly.

 

Think you're a little harsh on Gerrard although I don't think he is at all exempt from criticism

[Guest Lennon]

Accounting for his age, in that position, he is absolute quality.

 

Think he is a bit more ambitious than Didi in his pass selection and therefore has a tendancy to give it away sometimes, but that should improve with experience.

 

First thing you've said that I've agreed with, well in.

 

What is he, 22?

[San Diego Red]

So it's settled then, we should sell Gerrard to Real Madrid for 50p. Torres is s***e as well, sell him to the Mancs for a quid. Carragher can't run for his life, sell him to Middlesborough. Mascherano, well he's aboslute s***e, he's off to the Bitters.

 

Come off it. Start saying all this b******s when we're in relegation places at the end of the season.

 

ffs.

[CarraLegend]

So it's settled then, we should sell Gerrard to Real Madrid for 50p. Torres is s***e as well, sell him to the Mancs for a quid. Carragher can't run for his life, sell him to Middlesborough. Mascherano, well he's aboslute s***e, he's off to the Bitters.

 

Come off it. Start saying all this b******s when we're in relegation places at the end of the season.

 

ffs.

 

In English?

[RP]

I was hoping someone would start a thread about the captain and his stinking, inconsistent form and general apathy at playing for us, which has constantly hampererd Rafa in his time here. But that would be silly.

 

 

Obsessed.

[Lee W]

First thing you've said that I've agreed with, well in.

 

Thanks for that. I'll sleep soundly in that knowledge now.

[Guest Lennon]

Gerrard was absolutely on fire the season before last.

 

But this isn't about Gerrard is it ?

 

We need him on fire now if we're ever going to challenge. Forget Torres, Gerrard is the key.

 

It's not just his general inconsistency that bothers me, it's his poor attitude and lack of leadership.

 

He's never shy of telling us what we need to do, so lets se him go out and do it, and not just in one off games when he can be bothered.

[George Costanza]

I think he is more suited to playing in a 5 man midfield where he has 2 good attacking players to give the ball to with a short ball. In a 4 where he is required to create more he doesn't convince me.

 

 

Don't agree with your views on Mascherano. I think he's a fantastic player and will be every bit as good as Makelele has been over the years (if not even better) However I do agree with this to an extent, but even in a four he shouldn't need to be creative. Win it and give it simple. The front 5 should be good enough to do the rest. Problem we're having is that our creative players (well the few ones we actually have) aren't playing that well either.

[sutty]

His other performances that he has put in for LFC, I am judging him how he is as a player.

I know what type of player he is, if he plays that position his ball retention has to be much, much better than it is. Didi Hamann-esque.

I am not picking holes in a particular performance, I have watched him in virtually all the games he has played in for us and I am not convinced he is anything special.

 

 

Those were the exact limitations that Hamann was accused of.

 

Think you are being harsh

[Guest Lennon]

I think a lot of his average passing this season can be attributed to the lack of movement throughout the team. Our forward players are so static at times. For the Argies he has so many options with players making intelligent runs and dropping deep and creating space.

 

Alonso also suffers in that respect and often finds himself caught in possession.