Bascombe/Usher etc.

[anny road]

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-f...-name_page.html

that's interesting.

do we think it's Rafa trying to keep prices down or does it mean that Bascombe/Usher/The Count could be right?

 

 

right about what?? they were saying we didnt have money and we had to sell to buy....we bought a player for £20m yesterday unless i missed it......

 

of course we have to sell....as it stands we have a winger and a foward on the books who have either been replaced (Bellamy) or will son be (Gonzalez)........

 

Dave U/The Count/Bascombe have been wrong at every turn this summer....until we showed interest in Torres, then they changed there tack "Oh we do have money now"........

[Stevie H]

don't think this 'needs to sell' thing has anything to do with transfer budget. could see it being a wage bill / squad size issue of course, and it's obvious rafa wants bellamy gone 'cos he's a little tw*t, but that's all.

[Lee W]

right about what?? they were saying we didnt have money and we had to sell to buy....we bought a player for £20m yesterday unless i missed it......

 

of course we have to sell....as it stands we have a winger and a foward on the books who have either been replaced (Bellamy) or will son be (Gonzalez)........

 

Dave U/The Count/Bascombe have been wrong at every turn this summer....until we showed interest in Torres, then they changed there tack "Oh we do have money now"........

 

To be fair to Dave U and Bascombe they only pass on what they've been told, are generally well informed and don't pretend to be someone they're not. The other is a poor mans newsnow clone.

[magneto]

Dave U/The Count/Bascombe have been wrong at every turn this summer....until we showed interest in Torres, then they changed there tack "Oh we do have money now"........

 

They may still be correct. I'm not taking sides here, but all we've paid is 20 million for Torres. That could be Cisse, Garcia Bellamy and Gonzalez's money i.e. net spend = 0

[Cunny]

right about what?? they were saying we didnt have money and we had to sell to buy....we bought a player for £20m yesterday unless i missed it......

 

of course we have to sell....as it stands we have a winger and a foward on the books who have either been replaced (Bellamy) or will son be (Gonzalez)........

 

Dave U/The Count/Bascombe have been wrong at every turn this summer....until we showed interest in Torres, then they changed there tack "Oh we do have money now"........

 

they said our net spend would be roughly similar to normal and no extra cash would be available, they didn't say we were skint.

I think we have spent about £20m net so far this summer, which I believe is roughly around our normal spend.

 

you are right about the change of tack though - who knows?

[JimmyF]

right about what?? they were saying we didnt have money and we had to sell to buy....we bought a player for £20m yesterday unless i missed it......

 

of course we have to sell....as it stands we have a winger and a foward on the books who have either been replaced (Bellamy) or will son be (Gonzalez)........

 

Dave U/The Count/Bascombe have been wrong at every turn this summer....until we showed interest in Torres, then they changed there tack "Oh we do have money now"........

I think only at the end of this summer can we really say who was correct, signing Torres was fantastic step but that 1 signing other teams are spending £17-20M on multiple signings. This stuff about selling before buying worries me but I think it could be just an attempt to put teams from raising prices on us, who knows. Lets see the quality of player we sign for the wing, that will give a truer indication.

[anny road]

They may still be correct. I'm not taking sides here, but all we've paid is 20 million for Torres. That could be Cisse, Garcia Bellamy and Gonzalez's money i.e. net spend = 0

 

 

we havn't sold them

 

they were telling us we had to sell to buy...we havn't we have bought without selling

 

you can dress it up all you like, but Bascombe was aggressively pushing foward a line that we were not being given any money on top of sales.....that we didnt have the money we had been told and that Rafa was pissed off...Dave U was passing in what Bascombe told him....he also said the players were worried, which i dont believe......he wqs s*** stirring and using the fact that he knows a player to make out that he had inside knowledge. I think he was lying.......there I have said it, I have slagged the mighty Usher off....god strike me down

 

As for Bascombe, I think he was getting the silent treatment off Rafa....I dont think he had any inside knowledge and pedalled a line on instinct which turned out to be wrong. At the press conference yesterday Rafa said something like...others were saying things, but we couldnt say anything as we were working hard on things...

 

I have no inisde knowledge whatsoever, but it was clear that our financial picture would only come clear once the Spanish league finished......What happens....La Liga finishes and we smash our transfer record.

 

and it wasnt based on money from sales as we havnt sold any of them yet.

 

People are quick to praise when Usher or Bascombe gets stuff right, but cant criticise him for whatever reason.

 

They were wrong

 

all my opinion obviously and I could be wrong myself

Edited July 5, 2007 by anny road

[Cunny]

He says we have to sell, and then says but hopefully not before we sign at least one winger.

 

How that could mean that we're skint I don't know.

 

Of course we have to sell, Gonzalez didn't settle, Cisse is sh*t and Bellamy's an *rse

 

 

I take it from his quote that the reason for the sales would be financial, to fund further buys, hence the reference to timing of transfers.

could be wrong though.

[usualsuspect]

He says we have to sell, and then says but hopefully not before we sign at least one winger.

 

How that could mean that we're skint I don't know.

 

Of course we have to sell, Gonzalez didn't settle, Cisse is sh*t and Bellamy's an *rse

Could certainly mean we are skint if that means we are limited on the price we can offer before we sell.

 

To be fair though I think we are playing the skint card to keep prices down.

[honourablegeorge]

Fact is, with the new TV deal, the CL money and the players we have to sell, the Torres fee plus another £20m shouldn't be a problem, with or without G&T's money

[Lee W]

The bottom line here is that we're kept guessing about the budget by the bosses comments.

 

We might have to sell to buy, we might just continue with our targets without the need to sell (immediately).

 

The important thing is other selling clubs are also kept guessing....

[cymrococh]

Somehow I think so too. Rafa is known not to spend over the odds, so he just want's to keep it that way

Exactly, papers/internet legends are briefed that we're skint + Torres says we're the only place he wants to go = no bidding war at Athletico and we pay a pretty normal price for such a talent.

[Ronnie Whelan]

The sales of those who are currently 'on the market' (correct me if im wrong) should generate:

 

Djibs: £8m

Bellamy: £10m

Gonzalez (Personally I would like to see us hold onto him): £4m

 

I have thoroughly examined the Garcia deal but I am assuming the deal was set at £24m with us giving Luis at £4m then £20m in whatever way, so, no cash in from Luis.

 

Thats generating a net of £22m, plus there are others on the verge of moving which could generate a few more quid. If Rafa has that to use as he sees fit plus whatever G&H give him then he should have substantial funds still at his disposal. I dont believe for one second that he was not offered funds from the G&H, but will not even hazard a guess as to what that may have been.

 

The net result, IMO, is that we should still have the effect of whatever G&H have offered to Rafa as a 'kitty' in order to bring in the final 3 players, RB possibly, RM & LM.

[McBain]

The sales of those who are currently 'on the market' (correct me if im wrong) should generate:

 

Djibs: £8m

Bellamy: £10m

Gonzalez (Personally I would like to see us hold onto him): £4m

 

All 3 of those are high

 

Not in a Rio Ferdinand sense though with missed urine tests and all that

Edited July 5, 2007 by Mcbain

[Kite]

Bascombe had it before he went off on holidays that we needed to sell Kewell and Bellamy in order to scrape together enough funds to buy Forlan. I think he ought to feel a bit embarrassed about that, he clearly hadn't a clue what was really going on at the club at the time.

 

At this stage, it would be understandable if future purchases did depend on getting rid of some players. Don't forget we also got in Lucas on the apparently non-existing budget, as well as about ninety youth players (though admittedly that would have been for small change).

[Bailo]

Fact is, with the new TV deal, the CL money and the players we have to sell, the Torres fee plus another £20m shouldn't be a problem, with or without G&T's money

Remember Leiva cost £8m and Leto £1.5m (I think). Add in all these yuoth players for £200k each and thats another million or so. So currently we've spent (not including signing on fees, loyalty fees to Gonzalez and Bellamy and probably Cisse) £30m+.

[Frosty Jack]

Remember Leiva cost £8m and Leto £1.5m (I think). Add in all these yuoth players for £200k each and thats another million or so. So currently we've spent (not including signing on fees, loyalty fees to Gonzalez and Bellamy and probably Cisse) £30m+.

 

which is the CL cash gone, now we should have funds from sales and the owners budget should it be required for a specific player, as they say.

[Leo No.8]

Personally I think it's blindingly obvious you need to sell players before you buy their replacements wherever possible. If you've already bought your replacement then the club buying from you are in a very strong negotiating position because they know you have to sell.

 

Clearly we have to sell because we've got a number of players who are (at moment) worth decent money and are surplus to requirements. I see people complain that we don't recoup enough for players we sell on, but the reason the prices are often low is simply because the buying clubs know we want certain players out of the way and off the wage bill. Competition between buying clubs can help, but we're never usually in a great position when selling players - all the biggest clubs have the same problem.

 

What Rafa said is that he'd like to bring in his next signing without having to sell first - I don't see what could possibly be negative about that. I think he's got a top winger lined up and he's been told he can sign him without selling which is great news. After that we shift some of the deadwood and bring in squad replacements if needed like Benayoun and Heinze. We should recoup £20m+ through sales, and if Rafa gets that money after having already bought Torres and a quality winger then we'll have spent a good old wedge and probably have a squad ready to challenge.

 

These people who jump onto every newspaper report or statement from the club and try to negative spin it - I just don't understand at all why they get off on that so much. I find it weird, like some sort of LFC S&M club. When they aren't saying the club is in ruins they're probably getting whipped by their other half...

Edited July 5, 2007 by Leo No.8

[god]

what is your obsession with dave u? he gets it right more ofthen than he gets it wrong...which is more than what can be said of some other posters who claim to be "in the know".

[MFletcher]

Lucas cost us €9M (according to Gremio's official website), so that was £6M spent on a non-necessary position. Momo has just signed a new contract as well. If we were in desperate need of funds, we certainly wouldn't have both Lucas and Momo now. I believe the line pedalled by Bascombe was his childish reaction to receiving no inside information. I could be wrong, but I'll be very wary of what he writes again. I reckon he only came up with Forlan's name because he knew that it would get supporter's backs up, thus encouraging them to believe his ridiculous rantings about a lack of funding.

 

And does anyone remember the story that we were only willing, and able, to offer £10M for Darren Bent? I'm pretty sure that was in the Echo as well. They really knew their stuff. I bet they'll spin it and say "money was made available", thus excusing themselves from their fabricated articles.

[Bootle Buck]

Lucas cost us €9M (according to Gremio's official website), so that was £6M spent on a non-necessary position. Momo has just signed a new contract as well. If we were in desperate need of funds, we certainly wouldn't have both Lucas and Momo now. I believe the line pedalled by Bascombe was his childish reaction to receiving no inside information. I could be wrong, but I'll be very wary of what he writes again. I reckon he only came up with Forlan's name because he knew that it would get supporter's backs up, thus encouraging them to believe his ridiculous rantings about a lack of funding.

 

And does anyone remember the story that we were only willing, and able, to offer £10M for Darren Bent? I'm pretty sure that was in the Echo as well. They really knew their stuff. I bet they'll spin it and say "money was made available", thus excusing themselves from their fabricated articles.

 

Momo's new contract could also have been protection for the club. If someone does come in for him they will have to pay top price for him now.

[c00p]

The Count went onto TLW saying that we were skint Dave U backed this up by saying that is what he had been told.

 

Dave went on to say that there was unrest between Gillett and Hicks regards how much we should spend and that Hicks was not too keen on the amount of authority Foster Gillett was going to have yet none of Hicks people would. Hicks then appointed that woman (sorry ive forgotten her name) joined Hicks and funds were released.

 

At the moment i think we have spent close to £30 million but expect to recoup around £20 million in potential sales so therefore that would give us a net spend on £10 million. We spent net £15 million under Moores.

 

The transfers have not stopped and i expect us to spend a few million on at least 1 winger but at the moment we have started the ball rolling but we need to continue spend quite a few more million to keep up with the top two and Rafa has stated he needs to sell to be able to do this.

[matty]

they were telling us we had to sell to buy...we havn't we have bought without selling

 

While you may be right, the order in which we buy and sell is hardly important. Doesn't matter if we buy on Monday and sell on Tuesday or Vice Versa.

 

If we end up when the window closes having recouped as much as we spent, then it's going to look like they were right.

[Guest Real Red]

I think Bascombe said that we were no longer in the market for Eto'o - and it said in the Times today that we had been offered him for the sort of money perhaps most of us were expecting we'd be getting.

 

He then said we were looking at a list that included Forlan, who would still cost a club-record fee.

 

Then Rafa said "I've had some interesting phone calls" - perhaps Torres's people had been on?

 

The Count clarified what he'd said around the time of Bascombe's articles by saying Rafa wasn't getting extra money for transfers. He could spend whatever we had leftover from sales, tickets, tv money etc, obviously after paying other running costs. There was no extra money being added to the budget.

 

What was making things worse was that Rafa seemed to want the money to be there up front. He knows he'll almost certainly get £xm for Bellamy and the others, he wanted the money now, to be paid back when the sales went through. The books would still balance over the summer, but he would not be losing out on targets by waiting for the sales to be completed.

 

Rafa has hinted today that he has to use the money from player sales, at least to buy the second winger. He hopes he doesn't have to wait until the money has actually come in.

 

I don't think there is any extra money coming in, but at least the owners have allowed him to have the money now from the potential sales.

[Jacko]

Personally I think it's blindingly obvious you need to sell players before you buy their replacements wherever possible. If you've already bought your replacement then the club buying from you are in a very strong negotiating position because they know you have to sell.

 

Clearly we have to sell because we've got a number of players who are (at moment) worth decent money and are surplus to requirements. I see people complain that we don't recoup enough for players we sell on, but the reason the prices are often low is simply because the buying clubs know we want certain players out of the way and off the wage bill. Competition between buying clubs can help, but we're never usually in a great position when selling players - all the biggest clubs have the same problem.

 

What Rafa said is that he'd like to bring in his next signing without having to sell first - I don't see what could possibly be negative about that. I think he's got a top winger lined up and he's been told he can sign him without selling which is great news. After that we shift some of the deadwood and bring in squad replacements if needed like Benayoun and Heinze. We should recoup £20m+ through sales, and if Rafa gets that money after having already bought Torres and a quality winger then we'll have spent a good old wedge and probably have a squad ready to challenge.

 

These people who jump onto every newspaper report or statement from the club and try to negative spin it - I just don't understand at all why they get off on that so much. I find it weird, like some sort of LFC S&M club. When they aren't saying the club is in ruins they're probably getting whipped by their other half...

 

Whilst I don't think you're wrong your logic must also work in the opposite direction ie we get a good price for selling someone but we pay top dollar when we buy because the selling club sees that we are without a striker/keeper, etc.