"Sh*t hanging on a stick"

[londonkopite]

http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/0,,2074386,00.html

 

Former Real Madrid boss and Argentine World Cup winner Jorge Valdano has slaughtered the managers of Liverpool and Chelsea - Rafa Benitez and Jose Mourinho respectively - after their Champions League semifinal meeting.

 

In a column for Marca, a scathing Valdano penned: "Football is made up of subjective feeling, of suggestion - and, in that, Anfield is unbeatable. Put a s*** hanging from a stick in the middle of this passionate, crazy stadium and there are people who will tell you it's a work of art. It's not: it's a s*** hanging from a stick.

 

"Chelsea and Liverpool are the clearest, most exaggerated example of the way football is going: very intense, very collective, very tactical, very physical, and very direct," he added. "But, a short pass? Noooo. A feint? Noooo. A change of pace? Noooo. A one-two? A nutmeg? A backheel? Don't be ridiculous. None of that. The extreme control and seriousness with which both teams played the semi-final neutralised any creative licence, any moments of exquisite skill.

 

"If Didier Drogba was the best player in the first match it was purely because he was the one who ran the fastest, jumped the highest and crashed into people the hardest. Such extreme intensity wipes away talent, even leaving a player of Joe Cole's class disoriented. If football is going the way Chelsea and Liverpool are taking it, we had better be ready to wave goodbye to any expression of the cleverness and talent we have enjoyed for a century."

 

Valdano explained why Benitez and Mourinho were to blame for the demise of flair and creativity. "The lives of Mourinho and Benitez have crossed in a world that is ever more scrutinised and exposed by the media, which is why they look at each other with such distrust," he wrote, "but they have two things in common: a previously denied, hitherto unsatisfied hunger for glory, and a desire to have everything under control.

 

"Both of those things stem from one key factor: neither Mourinho nor Benitez made it as a player. That has made them channel all their vanity into coaching. Those who did not have the talent to make it as players do not believe in the talent of players, they do not believe in the ability to improvise in order to win football matches. In short, Benitez and Mourinho are exactly the kind of coaches that Benitez and Mourinho would have needed to have made it as players."

[mally]

i thought the s*** went into plastic cups

[londonkopite]

Real Madrid have won nothing this year and haven't done since cavemen, maybe he is a little jealous?

[yellow jumper]

benitez told 'em to shove their job. suspect mourinho might have done too.

[The Hitman]

He's gone completely over the top there,but I can see what he's saying.

The difference is,we play that way because we can't afford the players with the tremendous skills that he mentions,and be successful at the highest level.We do what is required.

Chelsea have no such excuse.

[Ronnie Whelan]

Who gives a s***, hanging from stick or no.

[G Richards]

Behind his caustic remarks lies something close to a valid point. The football wasn't all that great and many said so afterwards. But the point is that you will rarely get great football when there is so much at stake. Add in two managers who don't like each other, the familiarity of the teams to cancel each other out, and the more physical approach in the Prem, and it was never going to be pretty.

 

But that matters not one jot. We knocked out Barcelona and Chelsea, two of the best teams in Europe. We have also played some good stuff along the way but this is overlooked by some of the more bitter or myopic commentators.

[Jeff guitar]

Personally, thought our semi goal was sublime and if it had been Madrid or Barca who scored it there would have been high praise for it.

Goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooaaaal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Armin_Tamzarian]

No doubt we won ugly and no doubt we're a crowd that, rightly, puts more importance on results than showmanship. Where he lets himself down is in his snipe at Mourinho and Bentitez failings as footballers. Firstly because Rafa made it as a pro which deserves respect and secondly because there's nothing to support his assertion that this failure influenced their style of coaching.

 

Perhaps Valdano and Real are feeling snubbed?

[Koogan]

Real Madrid have won nothing this year and haven't done since cavemen, maybe he is a little jealous?

 

He's no Djimi Traore either.

AFAIK he never was in a European Cup winning side. At least not with Real. Has a couple of UEFA Cup winners medals though...

[Gilps]

Real Madrid have won nothing this year and haven't done since cavemen, maybe he is a little jealous?

 

They're in with a very real chance of winning the title this year.

 

He's no Djimi Traore either.

AFAIK he never was in a European Cup winning side. At least not with Real. Has a couple of UEFA Cup winners medals though...

 

Has a world cup winer's medal too, to be fair.

[Gomez]

He's gone completely over the top there,but I can see what he's saying.

The difference is,we play that way because we can't afford the players with the tremendous skills that he mentions,and be successful at the highest level.We do what is required.

Chelsea have no such excuse.

 

That's not true either, we can play very well when we want to. We played that way against the chavs because that is the only way we can beat them, they play a defensive game anyway and if we played an expansive game against them, one of their many individual flair players would have produced something.

 

We didn't play that way in Barca and we beat barca playing football (conveniently forgotten by some critics) fact is, we have a plan A, plan B and probably a plan C,D and E.

[McBain]

It seems as though due to the importance of those two games we're constantly being judged as a poor side and a long ball side in general. As though nobody has ever seen us before. It's innacurate. We played that way at times in those games but there's far more to us than that.

 

Hopefully the final will show that. And if it doesn't. If we win on a set piece or long ball then so f***ing be it. I wont be upset

[magneto]

They're in with a very real chance of winning the title this year.

Has a world cup winer's medal too, to be fair.

 

So does he....

 

[The Hitman]

That's not true either, we can play very well when we want to. We played that way against the chavs because that is the only way we can beat them, they play a defensive game anyway and if we played an expansive game against them, one of their many individual flair players would have produced something.

 

We didn't play that way in Barca and we beat barca playing football (conveniently forgotten by some critics) fact is, we have a plan A, plan B and probably a plan C,D and E.

Sorry,I should've added against Chelsea.I was going to cite the games against Leverkusen and the first leg against Juventus in our first campaign of evidence that we can play "football".

[matty]

Pure jealousy and bitterness.

 

Barcelona won the European Cup last year playing very beautiful football. Surely the whole game hasn't changed in the space of 12 months where the teams have become so tight and functional??? No, of course not. And Rafa's Valencia played fantastic football, and I tihnk we will once he has the squad of his dreams.

 

Valdano can kiss my town halls.

[Gilps]

So does he....

 

Yes Valdano was clearly the Diomede of 86

 

Dismiss what he's saying by all means, I don't agree with it myself, but dismissing him as a nobody who won nothing himself just makes you look a bit silly.

[_00_deathscar]

We have scored the 2nd most number of goals in Europe this season, 4 more than Milan, and f*** knows how many more than Madrid.

[floyd]

some of the football the fans have been subjected too this season watching Franco's Madrid at the Bernabeu, is defiantely like watching s*** on a stick. Has he forgot that.

[Koogan]

Yes Valdano was clearly the Diomede of 86

 

Dismiss what he's saying by all means, I don't agree with it myself, but dismissing him as a nobody who won nothing himself just makes you look a bit silly.

 

I didn't say he's a nobody. just stated a couple of facts about his club career, which I think are relevant in the context.

Besides, when he won the WC Argentina had Maradona.

 

FWIW, I didn't mention his WC win, because it's already mentioned in the article...

Edited May 8, 2007 by Koogan

[_00_deathscar]

Has a world cup winer's medal too, to be fair.

 

As would I if I played in that team with Maradona in it...

[Gilps]

I didn't say he's a nobody. just stated a couple of facts about his club career, which I think are relevant in the context.

Besides, when he won the WC Argentina had Maradona.

 

The same Maradona who also never won a European Cup medal? He'd better not comment either then I guess.

[Ostrich Man]

Pure jealousy and bitterness.

" it would be bitterness if we were less successful than you. The word you want is disdain"

 

"I think words must have different meanings where you're from.

 

Why would we be bitter about you? We've won much more."

 

 

[Guest Anders Honoré]

They're in with a very real chance of winning the title this year.

 

Playing the most defensive football they ever have with Capello at the helm.

[smithdown]

As would I if I played in that team with Maradona in it...

 

 

Benitez would have dropped Maradona and played you instead.