Ronnie Whelan on Rafa

[Tyler]

Article from today's Irish Independent

 

 

PEOPLE are asking Rafa Benitez the wrong questions in their bid to get to the bottom of Liverpool's current lack of form.

 

They're asking him if rotating his squad so frequently is doing more harm than good. I'm not sure if it's too relevant an issue. The real problem is that the players he has just aren't good enough.

 

Rightly or wrongly, any Liverpool team will always be compared with the legendary league winning selections of the past. And I honestly believe that from the current squad it's only Steven Gerrard that would have figured in the great sides that I was lucky to be a part of.

 

Of the rest, I'd say the only one to come close would be another Scouser in the shape of Jamie Carragher and while Xabi Alonso was very impressive last season, he's been a shadow of himself since the World Cup. His season hasn't even started yet.

 

A lot of the other players haven't been playing well this season but the issue could simple be that they're just not good enough in the first place. Certainly, the summer signings don't appear to have made Liverpool the serious title contenders that some believed they would be at the start of August.

 

Dutch striker Dirk Kuyt works hard and perhaps it's too early to be judging him. And you could say the same about Craig Bellamy but from what we've seen you would be sceptical about considering him a really top player. It's the same with Jermaine Pennant, Mark Gonzalez and some of the other new faces.

 

Last weekend's dismal showing against Manchester United was depressing. I really couldn't believe how many times Liverpool were softly giving away possession in the centre of the park.

 

When I came to Liverpool first, the simplest message we got, which came down from Bill Shankly, was that when we got the ball, all we have to do is make sure we get it to a red shirt.

 

Sure, Liverpool were doing plenty of that last Sunday but the only problem was that Manchester United were wearing red. It's the lack of real football brains in the current squad that Benitez has assembled which would worry me.

 

I can not understand why he keeps playing Luis Garcia away from home. He doesn't have strength and he doesn't have passing ability. The Spaniard is a liability for such tough games.

 

Just look at the situation now - down in 11th place needing a miracle to get back into the picture, with the title already out of the equation. In 1981-82 we were 12th at Christmas and still managed to win the league.

 

But that was a dressing room which included guys like Phil Neal, Alan Hansen, Phil Thompson, Graeme Souness and Kenny Dalglish. There's no one of that calibre to drag them out of their current mire.

 

We could go away from home in games, to places like Bolton and Blackburn, and come up against sides that would try and kick us for the first 60 minutes. The difference was we had the fight to get through that and eventually they would give up. Then our ability would come through and we would win the game.

 

This Liverpool side doesn't have the fortitude to cope with that 60 minutes and that's why they haven't a chance of winning the league with this squad.

 

In his defence, Benitez says that they had a worse start last season and they came back to qualify for the Champions League and win the cup. And that's fair enough. But already we're at a situation when that's probably the most they can achieve again unless they produce something special in Europe.

 

In any top club, they look for progress from year to year but Liverpool appear to have stalled. They've spent a fortune in the summer but they're still where they were this time last year.

 

They might have players who are good enough to produce it for the odd big occasion. Collectively, however, they don't have the strength to make that last over the course of the season. He can rotate the squad because they've got quantity. It's the quality that they're missing.

 

Ronnie Whelan

[muleskinner]

Agree with some of what he says but to suggest that there isn't the character in the dressing room of sufficient calibre to get them up the table is wrong.

 

 

Teams like Blackburn and Bolton don't give up after 60 minutes either.

[Tyler]

I don't think he is saying that they give up but rather that you need to match them physically and then win through better ability

[muleskinner]

I don't think he is saying that they give up but rather that you need to match them physically and then win through better ability

 

"We could go away from home in games, to places like Bolton and Blackburn, and come up against sides that would try and kick us for the first 60 minutes. The difference was we had the fight to get through that and eventually they would give up. Then our ability would come through and we would win the game."

[Tyler]

yes - they give up trying to kick you if you match them physically not that they give up

 

watch arsenal away from home at some of these teams - arsenal have a reputation as not liking the physical stuff and these teams will up the physical part of their game to upset arsenal and it seems to work

[muleskinner]

yes - they give up trying to kick you if you match them physically not that they give up

 

watch arsenal away from home at some of these teams - arsenal have a reputation as not liking the physical stuff and these teams will up the physical part of their game to upset arsenal and it seems to work

 

Reading didn't get a chance to kick them last weekend.

 

I can see what Whelan is trying o get at but I think he is wrong on certain points.

[Kopfaithful]

the other difference is players like sounes would be sent off 10 times a season now. we were harder than most teams in those days. yes we could play, but the secret was we could hand it out with the best of them. that style of football doesn't exist anymore. bolton, although they're deemed physical is nothing on how football was when whelan was playing - al they do in comparision is just close the ball down a lot and make it difficult to play. they are all fit enough not to run out of steam in 60 minutes too. that was why we hated wimbledon in the late 80's - they were the 1st team that could hassle sides for the entire 90mins of the game and wouldn't just "give up". since then, just about all sides (including our own) have that work ethic and fitness to play for the entire game.

Edited October 27, 2006 by js

[John am Rhein]

Players not as good as best teams we've ever had shock!

[Nerik]

He is a bit fatalistic but it is true that most of the new signings still need to prove themselves. Kuyt for me has shown his ability but Gonzalez, Aurelio, Bellamy and Pennant have not turned in the form expected from them. Paletta has played too little to be judged. In some cases it is the new signings taking time to adapt i.e. the South Americans, but I did honestly expect more from Bellamy and Pennant by now. They have both done a bit better in recent games. Bellamy has scored, Pennant laid on 2 goals for us the other night. Still we need more.

 

As for him saying that only Gerrard and possibly Carra might make the great Liverpool sides, it is probably true. Then again who would make the 81/82 Liverpool side from the entire Premiership? Henry, Gerrard..........erm

[Tones]

He is right in saying that rotation isnt the problem. It clearly isnt.

[Raj]

As for him saying that only Gerrard and possibly Carra might make the great Liverpool sides, it is probably true. Then again who would make the 81/82 Liverpool side from the entire Premiership? Henry, Gerrard..........erm

 

Don't forget Rooney.

Edited October 27, 2006 by roegahnn

[Andy Mac]

Steve Finnan has had a very solid start to this season. I would imagine at this moment in time his name is one of the first on the teamsheet

[Nerik]

Rooney has the potential to make it, but has not shown it consistently. I'd have Dalglish and Rush ahead of him any day.

[fred milne]

Steve Finnan has had a very solid start to this season. I would imagine at this moment in time his name is one of the first on the teamsheet

I'm not sure I agree. I think he's had some ropey performances this season and hasn't reached the level of consistency he had last year.

[Guest Jack Bauer]

I think Steve Finnan has looked a bit fat, I dunno if it's the new kit but thats what it looks like to me.

[Maldini]

Ronnie is a nice guy, but his opinion changes with the wind.

[Kite]

He's wrong to suggest that only Steven Gerrard would get into teams of the past, that's just misty eyed, red tinted glasses stuff... And a boring cliche to boot. I think there's plenty of examples of players that played in the Eighties that wouldn't get on the present teamsheet, for example.

 

And then to go on and say maybe it's too early to judge some of the players.... Of course it f***ing is. We've made more personnel changes this summer than last so of course it's going to make an impact on team cohesion etc

 

PS I think Steve Finnan had one ropey performance and that was on the back of International duty with Ireland where, following getting an embarrassing mauling by Cyprus I reckon his head just wasn't right. Otherwise he's having a fine season.

[Raj]

Rooney has the potential to make it, but has not shown it consistently. I'd have Dalglish and Rush ahead of him any day.

 

I was only joking (just realise that I deleted the similie).

I wouldnt have him ahead of any of our title winning strikers.

[Guest Red & Green]

Ronnie is a nice guy, but his opinion changes with the wind.

 

 

Nice guy maybe but he comes across as a bit of dope on the radio.

[Bootle Buck]

the other difference is players like sounes would be sent off 10 times a season now. we were harder than most teams in those days. yes we could play, but the secret was we could hand it out with the best of them. that style of football doesn't exist anymore. bolton, although they're deemed physical is nothing on how football was when whelan was playing - al they do in comparision is just close the ball down a lot and make it difficult to play. they are all fit enough not to run out of steam in 60 minutes too. that was why we hated wimbledon in the late 80's - they were the 1st team that could hassle sides for the entire 90mins of the game and wouldn't just "give up". since then, just about all sides (including our own) have that work ethic and fitness to play for the entire game.

 

Don't underestinmte the players he mentioned. That lot would have been winning everything today too. Sure the game has changed but they all did their jobs magnificently and were all leaders. They would have adapted. Back in those days players like Clemence, Neal, Souness, Hansen, McDermott, Kennedy(Ray) et al rarely had many poor games were they were "missing in action". That can't be said of today's squad.

[Leo No.8]

That article really is complete crap.

 

Any of our 'legends' who decides to inform us our current team isn't as good as they were loses a bit of my respect instantly. We f*cking know they aren't as good, and really don't need telling again, particularly not at the moment.

 

Why not include Ronnie Whelan's advice to Grandmothers on how to suck eggs.

 

We know they aren't as good - but the point is they were even further from where we wanted to be before Rafa took over. This is probably our strongest group of players since Dalglish resigned on paper, they just aren't performing.

 

You were a great player Ronnie, thanks for the memories etc but stick your annoying article up your a***, its of no point or use.

[hideNseek]

Ronnie is a nice guy, but his opinion changes with the wind.

 

 

I love Ronnie Whelan, my all time favourite Liverpool player. But have to agree with you. If we had won all our 9 games he'd be saying how good the squad was.

[Boca]

Anyone who has had the misfortune of listening to Ronnie's "expert" opinion on TV3 or Today fm radio will know that he is one of the least knowledgeable pundits out there. And that is saying something.

[sean]

I despise the pundit Ronnie Whelan but he's still one of my all time favourite Liverpool or any other player. The fact he talks out of his cake is of little consequence.

[Boca]

I despise the pundit Ronnie Whelan but he's still one of my all time favourite Liverpool or any other player. The fact he talks out of his cake is of little consequence.

 

He's one of my favourite players as well, but this thread is about an article written by him, not how good he was on the field.