Aerial Worries

[Leo No.8]

I think if you were to do a poll of who people's first choice centre-half pairing would be right now, a pretty strong majority would vote for Agger and Carragher.

 

Agger has been an absolute sensation this season, to the point where I'd actually say many would make him first choice. He's so composed on the ball, and I think that in particular has endeared him to fans greatly - everyone loves a skilful centre-half if he can defend as well. Hyypia is of course ageing (although not quite as quickly as some think!), and Carra has been a little out of form this season leaving the young Dane as most people's first choice directly in front of Reina.

 

When Carragher gets back to his best, it seems as though him and Agger will be first choice; however although I rate both players extremely highly I do have serious concerns about how susceptible we look aerially when they play together. I don't think that Carra not being the tallest centre-half has been an issue up until now because of having the nigh-on unbeatable in the air Hyypia next to him, to mark their tallest striker and head set-pieces and crosses away. With Sami starting to play less, it looks more of an issue to me.

 

Agger is OK in the air, as is Carra for his height, but my concern is that most sides have one forward who is dominant aerially, and without having one centre-half who can combat that, we may find ourselves conceding goals from crosses with greater regularity.

 

I'm not just looking at the goals we've conceded either (and we have conceded from a lot of headers this season so far), and knee-jerking about it, I'm looking at general play; I first worried about Agger and Carra's aerial capacity when in an otherwise fairly routine win against Newcastle, the only time they looked dangerous was when longer balls were flighted up to Ameobi, who in actual fact dominated them with the little service he did receive but they were that poor it wasn't really noticed. He's a strong lad, but no Alan Shearer.

 

Both Agger and Carra are more than happy to give back what they get; they are both strong and committed, can take the knocks and get back up. Both are also fantastic footballers in very different ways. However I'm just a little worried we may begin to be attacked more and more by the aerial route as Hyypia plays less, and whether that will mean that in the long term they may not work together as a partnership. At least in certain games against strikers like Ashton and Davies I wouldn't play the two together, and Paletta may come through to play with either /or of them in the future.

[johngibo YPC]

But Hyypia can come in for these games like he did at Bolton. And Agger will get better in the air i think.

[Gravy]

Sami and Agger anyone? Ducks for cover.

[Guest Anders Honoré]

as someone said when the search for a centreback was on, finding a replacement who can do what sami does and gives us pace and skill on the ball is more than just what we could use, it is the holy grail.

 

I think you just have to accept that all pairings come with deficiencies.

[KD07]

Reminds me of our Thommo-Hansen pairing, with the capacity to be as good if not better, no less. How did we deal with it back then?

[Cooldude]

Agger did struggle with Ameobi in that game

 

But Sami with Carra has its worries atm as well

[fred milne]

as someone said when the search for a centreback was on, finding a replacement who can do what sami does and gives us pace and skill on the ball is more than just what we could use, it is the holy grail.

 

I think you just have to accept that all pairings come with deficiencies.

I think you have to accept that all players come with deficiencies. The essence of a good partnership or team is that strengths and weaknesses are balanced out.

 

You could make a case that, given Reina's qualities, aerial ability in the centre-backs is a more pressing need than pace.

[Frosty Jack]

We've been taking Hyypias ability in the air for granted for years.

[Guest GeCk0]

For Agger it is part of the learning process. He did get bossed around aerially, but he's also still settling into the prem lifestyle which isn't exactly easy on defenders. He'll get better as time goes on. He has the physical ability.

 

BTW how is Paletta in the air? I know he's a tough tackler, but I've never seen him play.

[Bootle Buck]

I think Carra doesn't only benefit from Sami's height when he plays but he always seems to be the first line of defence while Carra almost sweeps up behind. Sami has been immense over the years in games when we are under the cosh. When we are dominating games and he has time his ditribution isn't as good as Agger's.

 

Sami and Carra were the best in the business last season (with Terry and Carvalho). As far as I am concerned they still should be the main partnership allowing Agger to rotate in for each of them when needed. Agger has his whole career ahead of him and will benefit from Sami and Carra's experience.

Edited October 5, 2006 by Bootle Buck

[Cooldude]

Agger took care of Drogba superbly when he's played him so you can't say he's weak aerially entirely, but there are some games where he shows signs that he struggles

 

It's just him adapting, he'll get better at dealing with the stronger forwards as he gets more experience

[Knox_Harrington]

Agger took care of Drogba superbly when he's played him so you can't say he's weak aerially entirely, but there are some games where he shows signs that he struggles

 

It's just him adapting, he'll get better at dealing with the stronger forwards as he gets more experience

And Hyypia was bossed by Rob Hulse. Currently I'd play Carra/Agger in the league every game because they are just the form pair and we need stability in the league.

[Earl Hafler]

I think Agger has been the form player out of the three of them and he and Carra make a good partnership. The aerial problems are because of the changes in defence and indifferent form of some players - i don't think it's a long term problem.

[Marvin]

There is one other solution. Play three centre backs. Would also solve the conundrum of how to fit Gerrard Alonso and

Sissoko into the same midfield.

[kop205]

Reminds me of our Thommo-Hansen pairing, with the capacity to be as good if not better, no less. How did we deal with it back then?

 

That is a massive claim to be honest. I think it is far too early to be saying anything of the sort, especially with regards to Agger.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think he is the real deal, a proper player - but those two you mention are all-time greats.

 

And I suppose we dealt with the aerial threat back them by so rarely giving the ball away and, when we did, having such a hard-working midfield to win it back, that they weren't overly exposed.

[fred milne]

That is a massive claim to be honest. I think it is far too early to be saying anything of the sort, especially with regards to Agger.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think he is the real deal, a proper player - but those two you mention are all-time greats.

 

And I suppose we dealt with the aerial threat back them by so rarely giving the ball away and, when we did, having such a hard-working midfield to win it back, that they weren't overly exposed.

Whilst he was no Yeats/Hyypia, Thompson was surprisingly good in the air for someone of his build.

[windy city red]

Agger took care of Drogba superbly when he's played him so you can't say he's weak aerially entirely, but there are some games where he shows signs that he struggles

 

It's just him adapting, he'll get better at dealing with the stronger forwards as he gets more experience

 

I thought Agger did pretty well against Sheva during the Community Shield too and Sheva is obviously no slouch in the air...

Edited October 5, 2006 by windy city red

[wacko]

I thought Agger did pretty well against Sheva during the Community Shield too and Sheva is obviously no slouch in the air...

No slouch, indeed, but he's not exactly reknowned for his aerial prowess, is he?

[kop205]

Whilst he was no Yeats/Hyypia, Thompson was surprisingly good in the air for someone of his build.

 

He was a bit before my time really, but I I must admit I did wonder whether his lack of ability was exaggerated a bit - not delieberately, but just because his other footballing attributes were more obvious.

 

Even hansen I think now overstatets his lack of aerial ability for comic effect a little bit - though I know there were some players (the likes of Joe Jordan and later Fashanu and his ilk) who did cause him some problems.

 

Back on Agger, he had a decent goal scoring record in Denmark which I wouldm imagine includes a few headers and suggests he can attack and win a ball in the air.

[Guest Anders Honoré]

I think you have to accept that all players come with deficiencies. The essence of a good partnership or team is that strengths and weaknesses are balanced out.

 

You could make a case that, given Reina's qualities, aerial ability in the centre-backs is a more pressing need than pace.

 

I think it could also be said the need for a genuine ballplaying centeback has been severely underestimated in the past few years. We look a different outfit passing at the back now we have one.

 

edit: this is sounding like an agger love-in post, so let me qualify it by saying that I don't neccesarily think agger should be first choice, just pointing to strengths and deficiencies.

Edited October 6, 2006 by Anders Honoré

[fred milne]

I think it could also be said the need for a genuine ballplaying centeback has been severely underestimated in the past few years. We look a different outfit passing at the back now we have one.

 

edit: this is sounding like an agger love-in post, so let me qualify it by saying that I don't neccesarily think agger should be first choice, just pointing to strengths and deficiencies.

I was actually thinking that you could argue Hyypia-Agger might be a more useful pairing than Carragher-Agger, if it weren't for Sami's age.

[Leo No.8]

I was actually thinking that you could argue Hyypia-Agger might be a more useful pairing than Carragher-Agger, if it weren't for Sami's age.

 

I'd certainly agree with that Fred.

[cestrianred]

I was actually thinking that you could argue Hyypia-Agger might be a more useful pairing than Carragher-Agger, if it weren't for Sami's age.

 

 

Spot on Fred.

But Sami's age is overblown.

He's 32, never been quick, not exactly fat! & could play for another 3-5 years with rest, good diet etc. How old was Pellegrino, Maldini, Baresi, Morten Olsen at their tail end career?

[Hector McDougal]

Spot on Fred.

But Sami's age is overblown.

He's 32, never been quick, not exactly fat! & could play for another 3-5 years with rest, good diet etc. How old was Pellegrino, Maldini, Baresi, Morten Olsen at their tail end career?

I think that Billly Costacurta is still occasionaly playing for Milan and he's 40.

[fred milne]

How old was Pellegrino at [his] tail end career?

Not the best example.